This was a problem through a period in Schafer & Sons pianos. After
only fix was replacing the knuckles.
Original Message------
Thanks, Fred. I wasn't thinking about the applying lubricant while the keys were still in place, but about applying lubricant while the felt punchings were still in place. I suppose you can just be careful about not going all the way down with the pipe cleaner if that is an issue.
My problem piano has graphite on the jack and repetition lever tops, but I don't think that it has really transferred onto the knuckles. This has been a problem ever since the piano was new, about 4-5 years. And I have tried brushing it, but again the squeaks came back. Perhaps I should look into Permalon . . .
------------------------------
Peter Stevenson RPT
P.S. Piano Service
Prince George BC
250-562-5358
ps@pspianoservice.com
------------------------------
Original Message:
Sent: 10-10-2015 14:49
From: Fred Sturm
Subject: Applying non-weaponized McLube to key pins
Peter,
In answer to one of your questions, McLube will harden felt - it is a hard substance in a vehicle that flashes quickly. So you should not apply it to the key pins with the keys in place, as it will be absorbed into the felt. For that application, I would use Protek CLP.
McLube 444 is sold as a lubricant (scroll down, it is the second product). The Mclube company also sells mold release formulas. McLube 444 is quite similar to the substance Steinway uses to impregnate action center bushing felt: it solidifies the material somewhat and provides lubricity. I do apply it to felt in one instance, brushing it on the surface of understring felt when restringing. I wouldn't do that on knuckle surfaces, because it would probably lead to noise. I have applied it to action center bushings in a couple instances, when they felt spongy but not really loose enough to repin, and it helped.
Permalon and Emralon, sold in spray form by Schaff last I looked, is good for jack and rep tops - that's what the free stuff on Steinways is, essentially. I vastly prefer that coating to graphite, as graphite transfers very rapidly to the leather, and always develops squeaks in my experience. (With Permalon, or polished bare plastic as in Kawai and WNG, the knuckles stay pretty pristine, and I have never had squeaks). I'm not sure that spraying Permalon on those surfaces (with a masking devise - I cut a slot in a piece of cardboard to reveal the area to spray) would work over graphite, might not stick.
Also, if you have squeaky knuckles with graphite transferred to the surface, you need to brush or lightly sand if needed to remove it, before applying teflon. Brushing usually does it, but not always. Light on the sandpaper, as you don't want to remove any more leather than absolutely necessary, but it seems like the only way in some instances (I have done that with knuckles that were graphite greased, and managed to get some more life out of them).
------------------------------
Fred Sturm
University of New Mexico
fssturm@unm.edu
http://fredsturm.net
http://www.artoftuning.com
"We either make ourselves happy or miserable. The amount of work is the same." - Carlos Casteneda
------------------------------
Original Message:
Sent: 10-09-2015 22:45
From: Peter Stevenson
Subject: Applying non-weaponized McLube to key pins
This is a very pertinent discussion for me. In fact, just last week I was thinking I should ask the list about the differences between the Protek products and McLube 444. Today I serviced the Ritmüller with the persistent squeaky knuckles that I had asked about several months ago. Sure enough, two knuckles were squeaking again. I have Tefloned the heck out of those knuckles, so I am thinking that the factory lubricant on the jack tip and repetition lever top were inadequate. The Prolube that I applied previously didn't seem to stick, so perhaps McLube will do a better job.
One of the main reasons why I have stuck with the Protek products is because I have heard that McLube will harden felt. Is this an issue when applying it to keypins when the punchings are still there? It is also harder for me to get, as I cannot order it from the American supply houses, as it's considered hazmat. In fact, I won a big bottle last year in Atlanta and had to give it away because I couldn't take it across the border.
------------------------------
Peter Stevenson RPT
P.S. Piano Service
Prince George BC
250-562-5358
ps@pspianoservice.com
------------------------------
Original Message:
Sent: 10-09-2015 21:45
From: Fred Sturm
Subject: Applying non-weaponized McLube to key pins
I guess it is possible that saturating key bushings with CLP or perhaps Profelt might have some impact on gluing in new bushings, though I doubt it would actually make it impossible to glue them successfully with hot hide glue. In any case, the use of powdered teflon on the bushing surface and McLube on the key pin would definitely have zero effect, no material would touch the wood of the mortise - or are you speculating it would? That this would constitute a "botched RPT key job?" ;-)
------------------------------
Fred Sturm
University of New Mexico
fssturm@unm.edu
http://fredsturm.net
http://www.artoftuning.com
"We either make ourselves happy or miserable. The amount of work is the same." - Carlos Casteneda
------------------------------
Original Message:
Sent: 10-09-2015 20:23
From: Jon Page
Subject: Applying non-weaponized McLube to key pins
All this speculative preference as to what material is best for lubrication is irrelevant until we hear from the likes of professional key restorers such as Michael Morvan, who I believe does not advocate the use of certain lubricating materials on felt bushings.
I know I have to deal with botched RPT action jobs but dealing with contaminated mortices is another matter.
------------------------------
Regards,
Jon Page