Pianotech

Hello all,

Does anyone know of an inexpensive way to touch up black finish, without popping a can of paint? I'm not quite sure what type of finish it is, but I can get a pic on Thursday, if someone would be willing to identify the type. I have a client scheduled for tuning on Thursday morning, and her piano has some ugly gouges in the finish. She has said something about it before, but is hesitant to take it to a refinisher because of the cost involved (its a Cable-Nelson spinet). 

Before you comment on it being a spinet, it is her spinet, and she loves that thing. So yes, I am looking for a way to please without a complete refinishing. Thanks for any advise,

------------------------------
Benjamin Sanchez
Professional Piano Services
(805)315-8050
www.professional-piano-services.com
BenPianoPro@comcast.net
------------------------------

Hi Benjamin:
First, the gouges have to be filled with something. How deep they are (dog chewing?) or just deep enough to remove the paint will determine how I go about touching up a damaged area. Deep gouges I usually use wood putty, Bondo, Quik-Wood, or such. Then it has to be top-coated after leveling and sanding smooth. After top-coat, the sheen has to match as closely as possible. Is the finish high gloss or satin or dead flat? Is the finish hand rubbed for a satin sheen (Steinway) or is it just flat (German Steinway). Or polished?
You can also use the wax crayons that the supply stores sell (Mohawk). If it's shallow, that will fill with black crayon touchup wax. If there's a good possibility that there will be lots of hands on the area, the wax may come off. Then you need to fill with a hard wax/lacquer stick and hot knife. This is more permanent. Beware that black isn't always black, and you may get a grey tint where the surrounding area is deep black. Then you need to spray over the area and try to blend it into the surrounding area. Various companies make spray paint for touchup, or somehow use dyes/pigments with a French polishing technique. There are also black touchup marking pens sold by Mohawk and Behlen (Rockler's) that will do small areas and edges.
Good luck.
Paul McCloud
San DIego


Original Message------

Hello all,

Does anyone know of an inexpensive way to touch up black finish, without popping a can of paint? I'm not quite sure what type of finish it is, but I can get a pic on Thursday, if someone would be willing to identify the type. I have a client scheduled for tuning on Thursday morning, and her piano has some ugly gouges in the finish. She has said something about it before, but is hesitant to take it to a refinisher because of the cost involved (its a Cable-Nelson spinet). 

Before you comment on it being a spinet, it is her spinet, and she loves that thing. So yes, I am looking for a way to please without a complete refinishing. Thanks for any advise,

------------------------------
Benjamin Sanchez
Professional Piano Services
(805)315-8050
www.professional-piano-services.com
BenPianoPro@comcast.net
------------------------------

Original Message------

Hi Benjamin:
First, the gouges have to be filled with something. How deep they are (dog chewing?) or just deep enough to remove the paint will determine how I go about touching up a damaged area. Deep gouges I usually use wood putty, Bondo, Quik-Wood, or such. Then it has to be top-coated after leveling and sanding smooth. After top-coat, the sheen has to match as closely as possible. Is the finish high gloss or satin or dead flat? Is the finish hand rubbed for a satin sheen (Steinway) or is it just flat (German Steinway). Or polished?
You can also use the wax crayons that the supply stores sell (Mohawk). If it's shallow, that will fill with black crayon touchup wax. If there's a good possibility that there will be lots of hands on the area, the wax may come off. Then you need to fill with a hard wax/lacquer stick and hot knife. This is more permanent. Beware that black isn't always black, and you may get a grey tint where the surrounding area is deep black. Then you need to spray over the area and try to blend it into the surrounding area. Various companies make spray paint for touchup, or somehow use dyes/pigments with a French polishing technique. There are also black touchup marking pens sold by Mohawk and Behlen (Rockler's) that will do small areas and edges.
Good luck.
Paul McCloud
San DIego

Original Message------

If you're limited to cheap, then a black sharpee.

Original Message------

Chris, the gouges may have been caused by a black Shar Pei.

Gary Bruce
Registered Piano Technician

CLICK HERE to schedule your next piano tuning.

405-285-8324 (store)

405-413-8863 (cell)
BruceMusicStore.com

We would love for you to connect with us!

Magic marker, with a barely damp shop towel in the other hand. Color any scratches going through to the lighter wood, then wipe with the towel, because the marker will leave a different sheen on top of the existing finish, but it will wipe off, leaving the black stain in the wood exposed by the gouge or scratch. 

For a gouge deep enough that it will be a problem even when colored black, the answer is probably to use a burn in knife and a black shellac stick -- but this takes practice. I bought the gear but haven't put in the time to get good at using it yet.

I use the magic marker with stage pianos in general, which get beat up, but it would work just as well with a cheap black spinet. It's not that the damage isn't still there -- it just doesn't shout as loudly after being colored. The barely damp shop towel can also clean up a lot of hand dirt when applied with vigor. The one caveat is that sometimes spinets have such cheap finishes that the dirt gets incorporated into the varnish, turning it to a sort of colored mud, and rubbing it off will get one down to bare wood.

------------------------------
Susan Kline
Philomath, Oregon
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-11-2017 18:30
From: Benjamin Sanchez
Subject: Inexpensive Finish Touch Up

Hello all,

Does anyone know of an inexpensive way to touch up black finish, without popping a can of paint? I'm not quite sure what type of finish it is, but I can get a pic on Thursday, if someone would be willing to identify the type. I have a client scheduled for tuning on Thursday morning, and her piano has some ugly gouges in the finish. She has said something about it before, but is hesitant to take it to a refinisher because of the cost involved (its a Cable-Nelson spinet).

Before you comment on it being a spinet, it is her spinet, and she loves that thing. So yes, I am looking for a way to please without a complete refinishing. Thanks for any advise,

------------------------------
Benjamin Sanchez
Professional Piano Services
(805)315-8050
www.professional-piano-services.com
BenPianoPro@comcast.net
------------------------------

Original Message------

Magic marker, with a barely damp shop towel in the other hand. Color any scratches going through to the lighter wood, then wipe with the towel, because the marker will leave a different sheen on top of the existing finish, but it will wipe off, leaving the black stain in the wood exposed by the gouge or scratch. 

For a gouge deep enough that it will be a problem even when colored black, the answer is probably to use a burn in knife and a black shellac stick -- but this takes practice. I bought the gear but haven't put in the time to get good at using it yet.

I use the magic marker with stage pianos in general, which get beat up, but it would work just as well with a cheap black spinet. It's not that the damage isn't still there -- it just doesn't shout as loudly after being colored. The barely damp shop towel can also clean up a lot of hand dirt when applied with vigor. The one caveat is that sometimes spinets have such cheap finishes that the dirt gets incorporated into the varnish, turning it to a sort of colored mud, and rubbing it off will get one down to bare wood.

------------------------------
Susan Kline
Philomath, Oregon
------------------------------

Chris et al,

I searched the Mohawk site for the piano lacquer m610-1307 and base concentrate m500-2246, but only found gallon sizes. Have you found anything smaller? What does a road warrior do with that much lacquer? 

I have a customer with a 1961 Yamaha p1 with a dinged corner down near the floor. For one thing, I wasn't sure whether this year of Yamaha used a similar finish as a modern piano such as that on my newish U1. Anyone have a clue what they put on those? I think the customer is willing to fix the ding if I can point her to the right products. My first impulse was to putty in the shallow gouge and then use magic marker.

thanks,
Scott

------------------------------
Scott Cole
Talent OR
541-601-9033
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-12-2017 13:20
From: Chris Chernobieff
Subject: Inexpensive Finish Touch Up

3 very handy products from Mohawk for touch and refinishing I use often are: Base concentrate stain colorant (black) m500-2246, Piano Lacquer m610-1307, epoxy putty stick m743-1570. 

For touch up you can apply the colored lacquer over the epoxy putty with a small brush, or use an airbrush.

Original Message------

Magic marker, with a barely damp shop towel in the other hand. Color any scratches going through to the lighter wood, then wipe with the towel, because the marker will leave a different sheen on top of the existing finish, but it will wipe off, leaving the black stain in the wood exposed by the gouge or scratch.

For a gouge deep enough that it will be a problem even when colored black, the answer is probably to use a burn in knife and a black shellac stick -- but this takes practice. I bought the gear but haven't put in the time to get good at using it yet.

I use the magic marker with stage pianos in general, which get beat up, but it would work just as well with a cheap black spinet. It's not that the damage isn't still there -- it just doesn't shout as loudly after being colored. The barely damp shop towel can also clean up a lot of hand dirt when applied with vigor. The one caveat is that sometimes spinets have such cheap finishes that the dirt gets incorporated into the varnish, turning it to a sort of colored mud, and rubbing it off will get one down to bare wood.

------------------------------
Susan Kline
Philomath, Oregon
------------------------------

Hi Scott:
You might give Ruth Wiess a call. Allied Piano 888 622-7426. She might have some touchup-sized bottles of paint. She also sells a full line of touchup materials, anything you need. Talk to her on the phone if you can, she'll answer all your questions.
Paul McCloud


Chris et al,

I searched the Mohawk site for the piano lacquer m610-1307 and base concentrate m500-2246, but only found gallon sizes. Have you found anything smaller? What does a road warrior do with that much lacquer?

I have a customer with a 1961 Yamaha p1 with a dinged corner down near the floor. For one thing, I wasn't sure whether this year of Yamaha used a similar finish as a modern piano such as that on my newish U1. Anyone have a clue what they put on those? I think the customer is willing to fix the ding if I can point her to the right products. My first impulse was to putty in the shallow gouge and then use magic marker.

thanks,
Scott

------------------------------
Scott Cole
Talent OR
541-601-9033



Original Message------

Chris et al,

I searched the Mohawk site for the piano lacquer m610-1307 and base concentrate m500-2246, but only found gallon sizes. Have you found anything smaller? What does a road warrior do with that much lacquer? 

I have a customer with a 1961 Yamaha p1 with a dinged corner down near the floor. For one thing, I wasn't sure whether this year of Yamaha used a similar finish as a modern piano such as that on my newish U1. Anyone have a clue what they put on those? I think the customer is willing to fix the ding if I can point her to the right products. My first impulse was to putty in the shallow gouge and then use magic marker.

thanks,
Scott

------------------------------
Scott Cole
Talent OR
541-601-9033
------------------------------

Scott,
I believe you meant to say Ruth Zeiner of Allied Piano. She has ALL the necessary finishing products for any touch-up.

~ jeannie

Jeannie Grassi, Registered Piano Technician
Island Piano Service
Bainbridge Island, WA
206-842-3721


Original Message------

Hi Scott:
You might give Ruth Wiess a call. Allied Piano 888 622-7426. She might have some touchup-sized bottles of paint. She also sells a full line of touchup materials, anything you need. Talk to her on the phone if you can, she'll answer all your questions.
Paul McCloud


Chris et al,

I searched the Mohawk site for the piano lacquer m610-1307 and base concentrate m500-2246, but only found gallon sizes. Have you found anything smaller? What does a road warrior do with that much lacquer?

I have a customer with a 1961 Yamaha p1 with a dinged corner down near the floor. For one thing, I wasn't sure whether this year of Yamaha used a similar finish as a modern piano such as that on my newish U1. Anyone have a clue what they put on those? I think the customer is willing to fix the ding if I can point her to the right products. My first impulse was to putty in the shallow gouge and then use magic marker.

thanks,
Scott

------------------------------
Scott Cole
Talent OR
541-601-9033

What i have found about finish touchup is that it is nearly as specialized as piano tuning, requiring a wide range of supplies, tools, and techniques (and especially the knowledge mostly gained from experience in using them) that need constant attention and renewal to keep them up to par. I'm not saying not to learn it...just saying there is a lot more to it than meets the eye. Be prepared.

One example only...Mohawk makes Brush Tip Graining markers which are fantastic for touching up scratches, dings and other marks, but you can't be effective with just one or two. You need to have a variety of colors available for the right match, like at least 12. Everything about touch up seems to revolve around having multiple shades (obviously...duh) and finishes at the ready. 

.02

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-14-2017 01:02
From: Jeannie Grassi
Subject: Inexpensive Finish Touch Up

Scott,
I believe you meant to say Ruth Zeiner of Allied Piano. She has ALL the necessary finishing products for any touch-up.

~ jeannie

Jeannie Grassi, Registered Piano Technician
Island Piano Service
Bainbridge Island, WA
206-842-3721


Original Message------

Hi Scott:
You might give Ruth Wiess a call. Allied Piano 888 622-7426. She might have some touchup-sized bottles of paint. She also sells a full line of touchup materials, anything you need. Talk to her on the phone if you can, she'll answer all your questions.
Paul McCloud


Chris et al,

I searched the Mohawk site for the piano lacquer m610-1307 and base concentrate m500-2246, but only found gallon sizes. Have you found anything smaller? What does a road warrior do with that much lacquer?

I have a customer with a 1961 Yamaha p1 with a dinged corner down near the floor. For one thing, I wasn't sure whether this year of Yamaha used a similar finish as a modern piano such as that on my newish U1. Anyone have a clue what they put on those? I think the customer is willing to fix the ding if I can point her to the right products. My first impulse was to putty in the shallow gouge and then use magic marker.

thanks,
Scott

------------------------------
Scott Cole
Talent OR
541-601-9033

You can add to this list of needed items, the room in your vehicle needed to carry all everything. Rags, cloths for polishing, cans of solvent, spray cans for topcoating and shading (a variety of colors). Double that if you're doing polyester, with a polishing machine, compounds, and on and on. Yeah, it's a whole other ballgame. If you're just starting out, and the tuning business is slow, you can branch out and do furniture. And piano stores will love to have pianos touched up too. It's at least as much of a challenge as tuning a piano by ear. Many choices to make, different techniques, different materials, etc.
Mohawk has an education program to teach how to do it. Ruth Zeiner (you're right Jeannie, my bad) has classes at conventions and elsewhere, and her products are first-class. She's always ready to chat if you need help too.
Paul McCloud
San Diego


Peter Grey Sep 14, 2017 8:43 AM
Peter Grey
What i have found about finish touchup is that it is nearly as specialized as piano tuning, requiring a wide range of supplies, tools, and techniques (and especially the knowledge mostly gained from experience in using them) that need constant attention and renewal to keep them up to par. I'm not saying not to learn it...just saying there is a lot more to it than meets the eye. Be prepared.

One example only...Mohawk makes Brush Tip Graining markers which are fantastic for touching up scratches, dings and other marks, but you can't be effective with just one or two. You need to have a variety of colors available for the right match, like at least 12. Everything about touch up seems to revolve around having multiple shades (obviously...duh) and finishes at the ready.

.02

Pwg


Original Message------

What i have found about finish touchup is that it is nearly as specialized as piano tuning, requiring a wide range of supplies, tools, and techniques (and especially the knowledge mostly gained from experience in using them) that need constant attention and renewal to keep them up to par. I'm not saying not to learn it...just saying there is a lot more to it than meets the eye. Be prepared.

One example only...Mohawk makes Brush Tip Graining markers which are fantastic for touching up scratches, dings and other marks, but you can't be effective with just one or two. You need to have a variety of colors available for the right match, like at least 12. Everything about touch up seems to revolve around having multiple shades (obviously...duh) and finishes at the ready. 

.02

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------