Pianotech

Hi, All.

As a investigation into the possibility of offering new pianos
for retail sale, I attended the NAMM Convention in January,
and am grappling with an overwhelming amount of information
regarding brands and fielding ongoing calls from sales reps
vying for my participation.

Being a small shop with limited amount segregated showroom
space, it is not feasible for me to take on a brand that will have
similar offerings in my area, such as Samick brands, Pearl River,
Haulun, etc. I simply won't be able to compete with price 
comparison shopping. 

Accordingly, I am considering higher end products that are
being offer to me as exclusives. But I don't have much exposure
to some. 

Under consideration are:

Petrof
Sauter
Schulze-Pollmann
Niendorf.

I am quite familiar with Petrof, and have worked on a few Sauter
and Schulze-Pollmann pianos, but Niendorf is a complete unknown
to me. I can't find much of anything about this brand. I did visit with
the manufacturer at their booth, and quickly inspected them. They
seem to be okay, but did not particularly impress me. They claim
that they are  made in Germany, but I think there was
also some qualification that the strungbacks are produce in 
China, which is becoming quite common.

Anybody have any input on any of these brands?

Thanks for any feedback.

Dave

------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

Dave

I would pick one that you personally feel is as good a brand as any. I presume the company will allow you to have 2 or 3 pianos on hand, which is about all you probably have room for. The other thing to be wary of is pressure from the company to sell their products. As a very small dealer, you're not going to sell a lot, especially the high end stuff. A piano might sit for a year before you can find the right person to buy it. That doesn't mean you'll only sell one or two a year, because if the customer likes and trusts you, he'll buy one of the other models from this company, just not the one that's in your shop, because invariably it will be the wrong color or model.

Good luck


------------------------------
Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
Mililani, HI 96789
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-18-2017 21:34
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Hi, All.

As a investigation into the possibility of offering new pianos
for retail sale, I attended the NAMM Convention in January,
and am grappling with an overwhelming amount of information
regarding brands and fielding ongoing calls from sales reps
vying for my participation.

Being a small shop with limited amount segregated showroom
space, it is not feasible for me to take on a brand that will have
similar offerings in my area, such as Samick brands, Pearl River,
Haulun, etc. I simply won't be able to compete with price 
comparison shopping. 

Accordingly, I am considering higher end products that are
being offer to me as exclusives. But I don't have much exposure
to some. 

Under consideration are:

Petrof
Sauter
Schulze-Pollmann
Niendorf.

I am quite familiar with Petrof, and have worked on a few Sauter
and Schulze-Pollmann pianos, but Niendorf is a complete unknown
to me. I can't find much of anything about this brand. I did visit with
the manufacturer at their booth, and quickly inspected them. They
seem to be okay, but did not particularly impress me. They claim
that they are  made in Germany, but I think there was
also some qualification that the strungbacks are produce in 
China, which is becoming quite common.

Anybody have any input on any of these brands?

Thanks for any feedback.

Dave

------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

Original Message------

Dave

I would pick one that you personally feel is as good a brand as any. I presume the company will allow you to have 2 or 3 pianos on hand, which is about all you probably have room for. The other thing to be wary of is pressure from the company to sell their products. As a very small dealer, you're not going to sell a lot, especially the high end stuff. A piano might sit for a year before you can find the right person to buy it. That doesn't mean you'll only sell one or two a year, because if the customer likes and trusts you, he'll buy one of the other models from this company, just not the one that's in your shop, because invariably it will be the wrong color or model.

Good luck


------------------------------
Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
Mililani, HI 96789
------------------------------

Dave

It appears you want one of us to justify you carrying Niendorf brand. I've never heard of it, but then 10 years ago I had never heard of Hailun, either, and it is now considered one of the finer instruments coming out of China. As I mentioned earlier, customers are going to buy a piano from you, not because of the name on the fallboard, but because they trust you. If you've inspected the piano, and like how they play and sound, go for it.  

------------------------------
Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
Mililani, HI 96789
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-19-2017 11:46
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Thank you, Wim.

You offer sensible advise, and I have already considered the same. I was actually

hoping to get feedback from anyone who might have more familiarity with these 

brands in particular, namely the Sauter and especially the Niendorf, as well as

idiosyncrasies of the more abundant Petrof line I may not have already seen. 

HI, Wim.

Thanks for posting again. 

I have been digging pretty deeply in an effort to cull as much information as possible. Some results have been achieved by a colleague who deals with counterparts in the European community. So far, he has been able to shed some light on the Niendorf brand. It may not be the line that I end up carrying, but the goal of selecting a name is getting closer. This is exactly what I am trying to find out. Thanks to everyone who has contributed to the discussion. Additional feedback is greatly appreciated. I am focusing on Sauter and Petrof as a quality level, but have not eliminated consideration of other brands, and have added August Forster to the mix. Niendorf is not eliminated, but the jury is still out. 

If anyone is or knows of a dealer of these brands that would be willing to chat, please let me know.

Thanks everyone

Dave

------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-19-2017 20:18
From: Willem Blees
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Dave

It appears you want one of us to justify you carrying Niendorf brand. I've never heard of it, but then 10 years ago I had never heard of Hailun, either, and it is now considered one of the finer instruments coming out of China. As I mentioned earlier, customers are going to buy a piano from you, not because of the name on the fallboard, but because they trust you. If you've inspected the piano, and like how they play and sound, go for it.  

------------------------------
Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
Mililani, HI 96789
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-19-2017 11:46
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Thank you, Wim.

You offer sensible advise, and I have already considered the same. I was actually

hoping to get feedback from anyone who might have more familiarity with these 

brands in particular, namely the Sauter and especially the Niendorf, as well as

idiosyncrasies of the more abundant Petrof line I may not have already seen. 

Dave

Just for curiosity, why are you considering selling new high end pianos, and then only one or two at a time?  The new market is very slow right now, all over the country, and people are just not buying expensive instruments anymore. Yes, some here and there, but you'll be sitting on a lot of money for may be a year at a time, when you could use that money to buy used pianos, or even better, have it a high yield money market account.

If you don't want to answer me, that's fine. As I said, I'm just curious.

------------------------------
Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
Mililani, HI 96789
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-21-2017 10:26
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

HI, Wim.

Thanks for posting again. 

I have been digging pretty deeply in an effort to cull as much information as possible. Some results have been achieved by a colleague who deals with counterparts in the European community. So far, he has been able to shed some light on the Niendorf brand. It may not be the line that I end up carrying, but the goal of selecting a name is getting closer. This is exactly what I am trying to find out. Thanks to everyone who has contributed to the discussion. Additional feedback is greatly appreciated. I am focusing on Sauter and Petrof as a quality level, but have not eliminated consideration of other brands, and have added August Forster to the mix. Niendorf is not eliminated, but the jury is still out. 

If anyone is or knows of a dealer of these brands that would be willing to chat, please let me know.

Thanks everyone

Dave

------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-19-2017 20:18
From: Willem Blees
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Dave

It appears you want one of us to justify you carrying Niendorf brand. I've never heard of it, but then 10 years ago I had never heard of Hailun, either, and it is now considered one of the finer instruments coming out of China. As I mentioned earlier, customers are going to buy a piano from you, not because of the name on the fallboard, but because they trust you. If you've inspected the piano, and like how they play and sound, go for it.  

------------------------------
Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
Mililani, HI 96789
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-19-2017 11:46
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Thank you, Wim.

You offer sensible advise, and I have already considered the same. I was actually

hoping to get feedback from anyone who might have more familiarity with these 

brands in particular, namely the Sauter and especially the Niendorf, as well as

idiosyncrasies of the more abundant Petrof line I may not have already seen. 

Original Message------

Dave

Just for curiosity, why are you considering selling new high end pianos, and then only one or two at a time?  The new market is very slow right now, all over the country, and people are just not buying expensive instruments anymore. Yes, some here and there, but you'll be sitting on a lot of money for may be a year at a time, when you could use that money to buy used pianos, or even better, have it a high yield money market account.

If you don't want to answer me, that's fine. As I said, I'm just curious.

------------------------------
Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
Mililani, HI 96789
------------------------------

Dave, 1) becoming a dealer (and succeeding) is very hard work these days.
2) Go visit the factories before making any commitments. Including wherever they source their string backs etc. The Shanghai Music Trade Show is held in October, which makes NAMM's piano selection look tiny. Follow the trip up with a visit to Adelaide Australia for the Aussie's piano technicians' convention.

------------------------------
Patrick Draine
Billerica MA
978-663-9690
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-18-2017 21:34
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Hi, All.

As a investigation into the possibility of offering new pianos
for retail sale, I attended the NAMM Convention in January,
and am grappling with an overwhelming amount of information
regarding brands and fielding ongoing calls from sales reps
vying for my participation.

Being a small shop with limited amount segregated showroom
space, it is not feasible for me to take on a brand that will have
similar offerings in my area, such as Samick brands, Pearl River,
Haulun, etc. I simply won't be able to compete with price 
comparison shopping. 

Accordingly, I am considering higher end products that are
being offer to me as exclusives. But I don't have much exposure
to some. 

Under consideration are:

Petrof
Sauter
Schulze-Pollmann
Niendorf.

I am quite familiar with Petrof, and have worked on a few Sauter
and Schulze-Pollmann pianos, but Niendorf is a complete unknown
to me. I can't find much of anything about this brand. I did visit with
the manufacturer at their booth, and quickly inspected them. They
seem to be okay, but did not particularly impress me. They claim
that they are  made in Germany, but I think there was
also some qualification that the strungbacks are produce in 
China, which is becoming quite common.

Anybody have any input on any of these brands?

Thanks for any feedback.

Dave

------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

Dave, 

Much agreement here on this issue, especially with Wim in that IF you are going to do this, don't even try to be price competitive. That's a killer. You need to develop a market that buys because they know and trust YOU, your judgement, your recommendations,  etc. In fact, you don't want price shoppers as they are always trouble.

Plus, you will be caring for it after the sale. You are where the buck stops, you the one and only person they have to ever worry about dealing with. You get the drift here. If you think this type of market exists in your area, and you dont need to depend on this for your livelihood, then you have a reasonable chance at success.

Finally, ask the company to give you names of other dealers so you can contact them and evaluate their experience. Assuming they are honest with you, that could help greatly.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-20-2017 06:33
From: Patrick Draine
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Dave, 1) becoming a dealer (and succeeding) is very hard work these days.
2) Go visit the factories before making any commitments. Including wherever they source their string backs etc. The Shanghai Music Trade Show is held in October, which makes NAMM's piano selection look tiny. Follow the trip up with a visit to Adelaide Australia for the Aussie's piano technicians' convention.

------------------------------
Patrick Draine
Billerica MA
978-663-9690
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-18-2017 21:34
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Hi, All.

As a investigation into the possibility of offering new pianos
for retail sale, I attended the NAMM Convention in January,
and am grappling with an overwhelming amount of information
regarding brands and fielding ongoing calls from sales reps
vying for my participation.

Being a small shop with limited amount segregated showroom
space, it is not feasible for me to take on a brand that will have
similar offerings in my area, such as Samick brands, Pearl River,
Haulun, etc. I simply won't be able to compete with price 
comparison shopping. 

Accordingly, I am considering higher end products that are
being offer to me as exclusives. But I don't have much exposure
to some. 

Under consideration are:

Petrof
Sauter
Schulze-Pollmann
Niendorf.

I am quite familiar with Petrof, and have worked on a few Sauter
and Schulze-Pollmann pianos, but Niendorf is a complete unknown
to me. I can't find much of anything about this brand. I did visit with
the manufacturer at their booth, and quickly inspected them. They
seem to be okay, but did not particularly impress me. They claim
that they are  made in Germany, but I think there was
also some qualification that the strungbacks are produce in 
China, which is becoming quite common.

Anybody have any input on any of these brands?

Thanks for any feedback.

Dave

------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

Hi, Patrick.

Great advice. I wish I could bankroll those types of excursions. Just getting to NAMM this year
took a lot of creative planning and budgeting. One nice thing that happened on that trip was being
able to add giving a technical seminar for the San Diego area chapters. Wish I had a rich aunt to send
me abroad.

Well, I'm off to go buy a lottery ticket...




------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-20-2017 06:33
From: Patrick Draine
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Dave, 1) becoming a dealer (and succeeding) is very hard work these days.
2) Go visit the factories before making any commitments. Including wherever they source their string backs etc. The Shanghai Music Trade Show is held in October, which makes NAMM's piano selection look tiny. Follow the trip up with a visit to Adelaide Australia for the Aussie's piano technicians' convention.

------------------------------
Patrick Draine
Billerica MA
978-663-9690
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-18-2017 21:34
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Hi, All.

As a investigation into the possibility of offering new pianos
for retail sale, I attended the NAMM Convention in January,
and am grappling with an overwhelming amount of information
regarding brands and fielding ongoing calls from sales reps
vying for my participation.

Being a small shop with limited amount segregated showroom
space, it is not feasible for me to take on a brand that will have
similar offerings in my area, such as Samick brands, Pearl River,
Haulun, etc. I simply won't be able to compete with price 
comparison shopping. 

Accordingly, I am considering higher end products that are
being offer to me as exclusives. But I don't have much exposure
to some. 

Under consideration are:

Petrof
Sauter
Schulze-Pollmann
Niendorf.

I am quite familiar with Petrof, and have worked on a few Sauter
and Schulze-Pollmann pianos, but Niendorf is a complete unknown
to me. I can't find much of anything about this brand. I did visit with
the manufacturer at their booth, and quickly inspected them. They
seem to be okay, but did not particularly impress me. They claim
that they are  made in Germany, but I think there was
also some qualification that the strungbacks are produce in 
China, which is becoming quite common.

Anybody have any input on any of these brands?

Thanks for any feedback.

Dave

------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

I may be "hijacking" this thread, but I would like to inject a related question that bears discussion:

Recently I have tuned at least two pianos that were new or very near new Chinese grands that I was quite impressed with (Hallet, Davis and Kohler Campbell?).  These were about $8000 pianos that I thought were well made, sounded and tuned well and had no major flaws.

Yes, I know I will be soundly attacked by the anti Chinese group and the cheap POS group, but these were good instruments (and I am no fan of the Chinese).  With a bit of qualified prep they could be made to play and sound quite well.  Having apprenticed in the 70s I well recall what was being passed off as "quality American products" and these instruments are an order of magnitude better than those.

I have also seen a few recent Czech instruments that were inexpensive and well made.

Perhaps approaching the entire market with a more open eye might produce another opinion.
As for me, I prefer to tune, service and respect the piano that is in front of me and I am being paid for.

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-21-2017 10:34
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Hi, Patrick.

Great advice. I wish I could bankroll those types of excursions. Just getting to NAMM this year
took a lot of creative planning and budgeting. One nice thing that happened on that trip was being
able to add giving a technical seminar for the San Diego area chapters. Wish I had a rich aunt to send
me abroad.

Well, I'm off to go buy a lottery ticket...




------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-20-2017 06:33
From: Patrick Draine
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Dave, 1) becoming a dealer (and succeeding) is very hard work these days.
2) Go visit the factories before making any commitments. Including wherever they source their string backs etc. The Shanghai Music Trade Show is held in October, which makes NAMM's piano selection look tiny. Follow the trip up with a visit to Adelaide Australia for the Aussie's piano technicians' convention.

------------------------------
Patrick Draine
Billerica MA
978-663-9690
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 03-18-2017 21:34
From: Dave Conte
Subject: Piano brand experience.

Hi, All.

As a investigation into the possibility of offering new pianos
for retail sale, I attended the NAMM Convention in January,
and am grappling with an overwhelming amount of information
regarding brands and fielding ongoing calls from sales reps
vying for my participation.

Being a small shop with limited amount segregated showroom
space, it is not feasible for me to take on a brand that will have
similar offerings in my area, such as Samick brands, Pearl River,
Haulun, etc. I simply won't be able to compete with price 
comparison shopping. 

Accordingly, I am considering higher end products that are
being offer to me as exclusives. But I don't have much exposure
to some. 

Under consideration are:

Petrof
Sauter
Schulze-Pollmann
Niendorf.

I am quite familiar with Petrof, and have worked on a few Sauter
and Schulze-Pollmann pianos, but Niendorf is a complete unknown
to me. I can't find much of anything about this brand. I did visit with
the manufacturer at their booth, and quickly inspected them. They
seem to be okay, but did not particularly impress me. They claim
that they are  made in Germany, but I think there was
also some qualification that the strungbacks are produce in 
China, which is becoming quite common.

Anybody have any input on any of these brands?

Thanks for any feedback.

Dave

------------------------------
Dave Conte
Owner
Fort Worth TX
817-581-7321
------------------------------