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What is a "grand piano?'

  • 1.  What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-10-2018 19:38
    ​​
    Well, it happened again………a professional tradesperson
    has, in print, referred to the grand piano (without reference to size) as a "baby grand" piano. What the hell is a baby grand piano? I've been renting performance pianos for 40 years dealing with theaters and booking agencies. These professional agencies never call our office and ask to rent a "baby grand" piano. It's time we get in line with the professionals and quit referring to the grand piano as a baby grand piano. 
    Also, it's aural tuning not oral tuning.

    Roger


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    Roger Gable
    Gable Piano
    Everett WA
    425-252-5000
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  • 2.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-10-2018 20:32
    And dor the new age people it's an aura tuning.

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    Larry Messerly, RPT
    Bringing Harmony to Homes
    www.lacrossepianotuning.com
    ljmesserly@gmail.com
    928-899-7292
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-10-2018 21:25
    Roger,

    You do know that the tuner who lost his arms is now an oral tuner, right? 😉

    So.... how would you classify the different sizes of grand piano? Personally, I'd classify them as follows:

    Baby Grand: less than 5'6"
    Parlor Grand: 5'6" to 6'7"
    Semi-Concert Grand: 6'8" to 7'9"
    Concert Grand: 7'10" to 10'0"
    Oversized load Mac truck - er, I mean piano: over 10' (hopefully they'll hire someone that can make it sound like ... not a Mac truck....)

    On a more serious note, what are the official measurements for the different size grands?

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    Benjamin Sanchez
    Professional Piano Services
    (805)315-8050
    www.professional-piano-services.com
    BenPianoPro@comcast.net
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-10-2018 22:19
    You forgot:

    Prenatal Grand: under 5'

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-10-2018 22:42
    Susan, 

    You're totally right! I did forget. Oops!

    Lately I've been referring to those as Spinet Grands. It's funny until you have to deal with them.... Still, they're not nearly as bad as upright spinets.

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    Benjamin Sanchez
    Professional Piano Services
    (805)315-8050
    www.professional-piano-services.com
    BenPianoPro@comcast.net
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 00:58
    Benjamin, prenatal grands have shorter strings than upright spinets.

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Posted 05-11-2018 08:14
      |   view attached
    Benjamin refers to grand(ish) pianos of less than five feet length as "spinet grands".

    INCORRECT!  A true spinet grand is pictured below!

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    Terry Farrell
    Farrell Piano Service, Inc.
    Brandon, Florida
    terry@farrellpiano.com
    813-684-3505
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 8.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 13:25
    Yeah, a Mathushek Spinet Grand.

    I tune one for a church. It's in good condition and at 440, seems to have spent most of its life on the West Coast, and if anyone would like to buy it, I think the church might be willing to sell it. A couple in their mid 90's donated it, after owning it for a long long time.

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 10:37
    Not to be confused, I hope, with a Grand spinet.

    Bob Anderson
    Tucson, Az


    Original Message


  • 10.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 22:39
    Please! The Grand spinet I tuned had a decal on the case saying "Artist Console."

    I called it Lying Bastard.

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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    Original Message


  • 11.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-12-2018 09:33
    In the first years of my working life a man who mentored me had this to say about the Grand brand: "Most piano companies don't set out to make bad pianos. Except this one."

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    Cindy Strehlow
    Urbana, IL
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    Original Message


  • 12.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Posted 05-11-2018 08:09
    Benjamin asked: "On a more serious note, what are the official measurements for the different size grands?"

    English or metric units. Your choice.

    ------------------------------
    Terry Farrell
    Farrell Piano Service, Inc.
    Brandon, Florida
    terry@farrellpiano.com
    813-684-3505
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 13.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 12:09
    Terry,

    English units please.

    Susan,

    Sometimes. I serviced a 4'7" grand yesterday. By definition it has longer strings than a 3' tall spinet. And it tuned up easier too. Better 5ths as well. So, in my opinion, I prefer grand "prenatal" size over upright spinets.

    That doesn't include "miniature" pianos, like the ones with only 50 keys....

    ------------------------------
    Benjamin Sanchez
    Professional Piano Services
    (805)315-8050
    www.professional-piano-services.com
    BenPianoPro@comcast.net
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 14.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 13:39
    To make an accurate comparison, you have to subtract the length of the grand devoted to the keys and keyslip, and also the tuning pin area is less crowded than that of a spinet, so you lose and inch or two there.

    I suppose I should have said the strings were shorter than a console's or studio upright's ... I sit corrected.

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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    Original Message


  • 15.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Posted 05-12-2018 09:51
      |   view attached
    Susan Kline wrote: "To make an accurate comparison..."

    Perhaps a better way to make an accurate comparison would be to lay the belly of a grand piano over the belly of an upright. Or, go one step further and get the soundboard out of the way so that you can see how both belly rims compare! Check out the photo below. I have lined up the actual rim of a 52" Mason & Hamlin upright with a faux rim (exact dimensions though) of a Baldwin M 5'2" grand. I took care to line up the belly rails of both rims so that one can see how they compare.

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    Terry Farrell
    Farrell Piano Service, Inc.
    Brandon, Florida
    terry@farrellpiano.com
    813-684-3505
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 16.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 14:17
    Funny!! 
    Benjamin, I basically agree with your run-down and it should keep us out of trouble-Uuuntil it doesn't! Lol. 
    But seriously, the only way to be completely certain is to simply refer to grand pianos including their length. "This is a 4'11" grand". 
    Or, "this is a 6'1" grand" and so forth. 
    Although it is IMHO acceptable to say, "it's a five-three grand" or a "6-eight grand" for short. 
    OR for a metric example, "Our Fazioli 278 is well umm..278 cm, or roughly 9'1.449" to round it off"!

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    [Kevin] [Fortenberry] [RPT]
    [Staff Techician]
    [Texas Tech Univ]
    [Lubbock] [TX]
    [8067783962]
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 17.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 02:15
    The only "official" reference I am aware of for the term "Baby Grand" was in an advertisement for a 5' 0" grand piano built in 1900 by the Weber company. 

    Having said that, I've had clients refer to everything up to a Baldwin SD-6 as a baby grand. 

    Technicians should never use these terms -- they are, at best, ambiguous.

    --
    Delwin D Fandrich
    Fandrich Piano Company, Inc.
    Piano Design and Manufacturing Consulting Services -- Worldwide
    6939 Foothill Ct SW -- Olympia, WA 98512 -- USA
    Phone 360.515.0119 -- Mobile 360.388.6525



    Original Message


  • 18.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 07:51
    I agree, refer to feet and inches. However I have seen on older Steinway model M the word Miniature cast on the top of the capo bar.

    ------------------------------
    Larry Messerly, RPT
    Bringing Harmony to Homes
    www.lacrossepianotuning.com
    ljmesserly@gmail.com
    928-899-7292
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 19.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 08:33
    Which, as I understand it, is where the designation "M" came from in the factory.

    Pwg

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    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    603-686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
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    Original Message


  • 20.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 08:39

    I thought it was:

     

    S=small

    M= medium

    L= large

    B= big

    D= dam big

     

    ��




    Original Message


  • 21.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 08:48
    Those are home pianos. Concert instruments are A, B, C, D. I'm not sure how O fits in.

    ------------------------------
    Larry Messerly, RPT
    Bringing Harmony to Homes
    www.lacrossepianotuning.com
    ljmesserly@gmail.com
    928-899-7292
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 22.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 13:27
    You forgot A -- awful large

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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    Original Message


  • 23.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-11-2018 08:50
    The model O had the word miniature cast into the pate in the same location as the M when it came out in 1900. Not sure when the O stopped having it cast in the plate. According to Kehl and Kirkland the O, L, M and S are all members of the miniature family. They were all referred to as baby grand at different times starting with the curved bridge O (1916 - 24) then the L (1923 - 27) the M (1927 - 49) and the S from it's introduction to the present. Interestingly the factory name for the M was the midget grand. I don't think it would be advisable to call it that these days.

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    Karl Roeder
    Pompano Beach FL
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    Original Message


  • 24.  RE: What is a "grand piano?'

    Posted 05-12-2018 17:13
    Ya'll are having too much fun with this subject. I'm calling PTG security! :-)

    I laugh out loud when the head of a college music department emails me to come tune the baby grand in the auditorium. It's a 6'4... duhhh. He is the guitar teacher at the college and the head of the  Art Alliance, where they do have a baby grand.  I just keep my mouth shut, about the size of a grand, vrs. a baby or petite grand, when he greets me, a rare thing for me to do. 

    Also a baby grand, that was a pre-natal grand doesn't take nine months to build, but it now takes more than nine months to sell one. Maybe that is why the number of pianos stores are so few today. 

    Bob

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    Robert Highfield
    Lancaster PA
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    Original Message