Kevin,
Thanks for your tale. The cause of this problem could well be something along the lines of what you posit.
Jon,
Thanks for your input on this. I always take your advice to heart. Did you remove the coils from the tuning pins before commencing with all of the wrenching back-and-forth with the tuning pins? Maybe it would not be worth the trouble to pull all of those beckets, if you only lost one of them in the process.
Not relishing the idea of sixty back-and-forth rotations times 230-some-odd of these super-tight tuning pins. Have you ever considered removing the beckets and then pulling the pin with a drill motor, completely or only partially, and then either turning or pounding them back in?
Peter,
Yes, could be CA treatment overdone, although did not notice any evidence of such upon initial inspection.
Fred,
Appreciate your comments, as always. Based on what you and Jon have written, I am planning on taking the worst of the bunch in the tenor section, remove the wire from both tuning pins, wrench one back and forth 20-30 times (as per Jon's protocol), remove the other pin with a drill motor (if I can!), inspect the threads for contamination, make an intuitive decision as to whether to drill or pound the pin back in, and do it. If it is STILL too tight (!!!), then I will remove the pin again and drill out the hole.
James,
The diagnosis is that 98% of the tuning pins are way too freaking tight! As stated in my OP, I did not have the time to bring tools not in my primary kit into play. I am sure that the torque of these pins is off the chart of the torque wrench in my stringing kit, anyway. Yes, it would be of interest to know the tuning pin size and torque. but regardless of those facts, the same problem remains to be solved. Did you have a suggested remedy? Do you recall any successful efforts to tame that Beast at NBSS (not tuning techniques, but method for resolving the issue of grossly excessive tuning pin torque)?
All best,
Alan
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Alan Eder, RPT
Herb Alpert School of Music
California Institute of the Arts
Valencia, CA
661.904.6483
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Original Message:
Sent: 05-29-2018 16:52
From: James Kelly
Subject: Extreme tuning pin torque and jumpiness
one quick way to make a diagnosis is to have had a tuning pin gauge in the bag. also have a torque wrench in your vehicle you never know when a beast will come along. we had a baldwin grand at nbss that was brutal . it had accujust hitch pins not a problem until you break one which was a fear. it was like trying to saddle break a horse or break the frozen tire nuts on your car to change a flat. true to form we called it "the Beast"
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James Kelly
Pawleys Island SC
843-325-4357
Original Message:
Sent: 05-29-2018 09:14
From: Alan Eder
Subject: Extreme tuning pin torque and jumpiness
No, this is not one of those "new" sports being considered for inclusion in the Olympics. I'm taking about THE highest tuning pin torques I have ever encountered, by far. When the pins DO finally release, they move a lot, with corresponding changes in the pitch of the string (and the sound of a small caliber firearm being discharged!). Did not have a torque wrench with me, or the means of shooting video of what it looks and sounds like to tune this beast (although both of these items are on the agenda for the next visit). FWIW, there were a handful of pins, scattered throughout the scale, that were far more normal feeling.
The piano is a hundred year old Steinway grand that has been restrung. Did not have time on that first visit to pull the action and examine the pinblock. In the mean time, I am left to wonder and speculate (not my favorite past-time, but in the absence of more data, it's all I have to chew on): Is it the original block, either treated with some disagreeable substance, or damaged in reaming, or restrung with too-large pins? Or could it actually be a new block, but so horribly drilled (too fast a speed and/or rate of feed? Dull bit? Too small a hole for the pin size used?), as to yield the worst feeling tuning pins I have ever encountered. It brought to mind someone describing breaking off a tuning pin (a pleasure that I have not personally had...yet) on a multi-multi-laminate Baldwin glue-block from the bad old days.
Of all the thousands of pianos I have serviced, the feeling of the tuning pins on this one are off-the-chart to an extreme degree. Do these symptoms sound familiar to anyone? And if so, were you able to positively ascertain the cause?
Thanks,
Alan
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Alan Eder, RPT
Herb Alpert School of Music
California Institute of the Arts
Valencia, CA
661.904.6483
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