Pianotech

  • 1.  Why do most modern pianos contain 88 keys?

    Posted 06-12-2018 16:19
    I have based all my thoughts and ideas on information that is hundreds of years old and still relevant today.

    Music theory - The Circle of Fifths:

    "The Pythagorean Circle was the grandaddy of the Circle of Fifths. Different revisions and improvements were made by Nikolay Diletsky in the 1670s, and Johann David Heinichen in 1728, until finally we reached the version we have today."

    Source: https://www.classicfm.com/discover-music/music-theory/what-is-the-circle-of-fifths/


    Tuning - 12-tone equal temperament:

    "In 1584, Zhu Zaiyu was the first in the world to systematically calculate the equal temperament of the music scale. His book, New Rule of Equal Temperament, explains a system using 12 equal intervals that is identical with that used around the world today."

    Source: 
    http://www.chinaembassy.se/eng/zrgx/wh/t100768.htm


    Tuning - Well temperament:

    "The well temperaments used throughout the 17 and 18 hundreds also allow one to modulate amongst different keys. However, the octave is not divided into equal steps."

    Source: http://www.math.uwaterloo.ca/~mrubinst/tuning/tuning.html


    I have combined all this information to "discover" how to theoretically correct the Pythagorean comma and how to physically correct the circle of fifths.


    Correcting the Pythagorean Comma Theoretically

    The perfect fifth has a value of 701.955 cents (3 d.p.). The octave has a value of 1200 cents.

    12 perfect fifths = 701.955 × 12 = 8423.46.

    7 octaves = 1200 × 7 = 8400.

    Pythagorean comma = 12 perfect fifths - 7 octaves = 8423.46 - 8400 = 23.46 cents.

    The circle of fifths is broken because of the Pythagorean comma.

    This comma can be "tempered out" by reducing the value of all 12 perfect fifths by 1.955 cents.

    701.955 - 1.955 = 700 cents. 

    12 fifths tempered by a twelfth of the Pythagorean comma = 700 × 12 = 8400.

    This compromise is necessary to close the circle of fifths.

    12 fifths tempered by a twelfth of the Pythagorean comma = 7 octaves.

    This can also be achieved by well temperament which contains unequal fifths (some fifths are tempered and some fifths are pure).

    The values, in cents, of all 12 fifths (pure and tempered) can be added together to get 8400. 

    Therefore, the sum of all 12 fifths = the sum of all 7 octaves if well temperament is used.

    The Pythagorean comma has been theoretically corrected now. The circle of fifths must be physically corrected now.


    Correcting the Circle of Fifths Physically

    Keyboards contain octaves that are divided into 12 semitones. Each octave contains 8 white keys and 5 black keys. The mathematics above indicates that, as long as 12-tone equal temperament and well temperament are used, 12 fifths = 7 octaves.

    This is the chain of 12 fifths:

    C-G-D-A-E-B-F#-C#-G#-D#-A#-F-C.

    This is the chain of 7 octaves:

    C1-C2-C3-C4-C5-C6-C7-C8.

    The number of keys between C1 and C8 (including C1 and C8) must be added to calculate the number of keys that are needed to ensure 12 fifths = 7 octaves. There are 85 keys.

    85 keys are needed to physically correct the circle of fifths.



    Well temperament is just as valid as equal temperament because it also theoretically corrects the circle of fifths.

    Due to the nature of 12-tone equal temperament, every semitone will have a value of 100 cents so it is possible to have an infinite number of keys and still maintain 12-tone equal temperament. The circle of fifths does not need to be physically corrected in this case.

    However, well temperament causes semitones to have different sizes. It makes sense to physically correct the circle of fifths in order to effectively use well temperament. 

    How can the extra 3 keys of an 88-key piano be tuned if well temperament is used? There are many different well temperaments which could make it difficult to track the different sizes of the remaining 3 semitones (85th, 86th and 87th).

    How can a fraction of a fifth be tuned if well temperament is used to tune a piano that contains a chain of fifths and a fraction of a fifth?

    An 85-key piano is "ideal" for well temperament because a chain of 12 complete fifths can be tuned and there will not be a fraction of a fifth remaining that needs to be tuned.

    http://my.ptg.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer/viewthread?MessageKey=fc9f0061-b137-400a-a523-f750cf9621ae&CommunityKey=6265a40b-9fd2-4152-a628-bd7c7d770cbf&tab=digestviewer#bmfc9f0061-b137-400a-a523-f750cf9621ae#bm0

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    Roshan Kakiya
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  • 2.  RE: Why do most modern pianos contain 88 keys?

    Posted 06-12-2018 19:17
    Because, I think that’s how many it takes to play it!

    Sent from my iPhone




  • 3.  RE: Why do most modern pianos contain 88 keys?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 06-12-2018 21:51
    Close enough for jazz.

    Pwg

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    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    603-686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
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  • 4.  RE: Why do most modern pianos contain 88 keys?

    Posted 06-12-2018 22:43
    To fill the needs of the repertoire.

    Chernobieff Piano Restorations

    Chris Chernobieff ( pronounced chur-no-bif )
    Associate Member of the Piano Technicians Guild
    Knoxville, Tennessee
    email: chrisppff@gmail.com
    Follow on:  Facebook
    phone: 865-986-7720








  • 5.  RE: Why do most modern pianos contain 88 keys?

    Member
    Posted 06-13-2018 11:00
    It seems to me that all fifths are contained in one octave. Shortening the keys to 85 only removes the highest fifth. That 5th, the F-C, is still in the center of the piano and will sound just as bad. 





  • 6.  RE: Why do most modern pianos contain 88 keys?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 06-13-2018 00:14
    Because too much is always better than not enough.

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    Geoff Sykes, RPT
    Los Angeles CA
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  • 7.  RE: Why do most modern pianos contain 88 keys?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 06-13-2018 10:30

    Isn't it the case that 88 keys is a modern standard? Harpsichords had fewer keys.

    I think the real question is what composers, especially those pushing the boundaries of the piano such as Beethoven, Lizst, and Rachmaninoff  were demanding. Is there evidence of how the modern piano industry came up with 88 keys? There are also physical limits; C8 and A0 rarely sound like a real pitch and are difficult to tune. It must have been harder to tune those end notes 100 years ago so no one wanted the notes beyond them.

    My theory is that it's convenient for the piano technician: when you have to replace 88 parts, they often send a bag of 90 in case you screw it up somehow.

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    Scott Cole
    Talent OR
    541-601-9033
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