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George Crumb piece

  • 1.  George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 10:45
    Hi gang!

    A student and faculty ensemble is getting ready to rehearse and perform George Crumb's Music for a Summer Evening, for two pianos and two percussionists.  I've had a quick peek at the score and will be getting an actual copy next week.  Looks like it's mostly plucking nodes, strumming, and scraping strings with a crotale striker, which is plastic.  The score has some out and out bad advice (mark nodes with crayon, extending into the bass section) but mostly it doesn't seem likely to inflict damage.  I'll make sure to be present for an early rehearsal and go over the score with the performers.

    I wonder if any of you have any insight as to what size or model piano he used when composing the piece?  Also, what size pianos are typically used in performance?  Any other insight or advice?  Not to be a scold, but looking for actual insight and not out and out dismissal of the piece.

    Thanks!

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    Zeno Wood
    Brooklyn, NY
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  • 2.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 10:57
    All I know is that Crumb had a Steinway L in his office, and its break works with Voice of the Whale and some other pieces, where a B or D don't. It's obvious, because sometimes you are asked to hold down a chord silently and strum, and often the chord crosses the break, so you simply can't do it. There are a few other details like that as well. There might be issues with reaching certain nodes, for instance. 

    That said, Peter Degenhardt, a German Crumb specialist, recorded all of his Makrokosmos on our Steinway D. I don't know whether there are any sections where that is problematic.
    Regards,
    Fred Sturm
    "Art is not a mirror held up to reality, but a hammer with which to shape it." Brecht






  • 3.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 11:04
    Thanks, Fred.  How did he go about marking nodes?  Any other specific methods you recall?

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    Zeno Wood
    Brooklyn, NY
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  • 4.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 11:35
    He used those little round stickies. There are three actually on strings. For the rest, He usually used a mark on a strut for reference. (What looks like white splotches on the SB is just camera flash).
    My personal preference is to cut a 1/8" strip of the sticky part of a Post-it, and fish it around the string, then stick it to itself and cut it short. Certain to stay put, and easy to remove.

    Regards,
    Fred Sturm
    "The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge, but imagination." - Einstein












  • 5.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 12:12
    These days, I see a lot of marking of nodes on wound strings by tieing a thread around it. The hills and valleys of the windings prevent the thread from migrating. 

    Alan

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    Alan Eder, RPT
    Herb Alpert School of Music
    California Institute of the Arts
    Valencia, CA
    661.904.6483
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  • 6.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Posted 08-31-2018 15:05
    Hi all, 

    My first introduction to prepared piano use at UCLA was seeing white out marked on the bass strings on our best concert grands!

     I really appreciate the comments and tips as we come up with some policies about this. 

    Sean 





  • 7.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 15:25
    Sean,
    We do have a policy document we developed a few years back, "Protocol for Extended Techniques in Piano Performance"
    Regards,
    Fred Sturm
    University of New Mexico






  • 8.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 15:23
    Revision of my prior "marker" suggestion -- I only meant on unwound wire. I don't remember if anything was done in the bass section.

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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  • 9.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Posted 08-31-2018 16:59
    Hi all,
    Food, drink, and trash on and around practice room and to a lesser extent, ensemble and classroom pianos, is a vexing problem for us at UCLA as well.
    I don't want to not address the issues of student responsibility and consequences; however, our strict rules posted in every practice room don't deter many students.

     I think there are real life challenge reasons for that.  We are bursting at the seams with a burgeoning music student population; we correspondingly have a chronic overcrowding and shortage of practice room resources.  This pressures students to "stay with the room" once they have it, and because they must stay with the room and not leave it lest they lose it, they tend to bring in their lunches and Starbucks with them for the long haul. Should they be so lucky to find one open in the first place.  

    Add to that: because of staffing/maintenance cuts, our practice rooms are annoyingly and chronically dirty.  Floors are filthy.  I won't work underneath a piano "down in the" practice room "salt mines" without first throwing a towel or moving pad down first.  So yeah, students aren't inclined to put their backpacks, instrument cases, and other personal items on the dirty floor, either.  

    I have thought about these issues for awhile, and what I'm come up with, especially for practice room, is that practice rooms need to be made more user friendly to begin with.  Small shelves, hangup hooks, even an extra chair or even a small table (security cabled to the wall of course, so they don't "walk off"! so that students have a place to put their items rather than on the piano top. 
    Then, borrowing inspiration from this thread!!  I'll place big reminder signs on each of the four walls of the practice rooms.  And pray.  





  • 10.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 12:17
    Excellent advice Fred! Our school protocol (we do have written policies like most SOMs, but in brief... this is the "bottom line" for this particular topic)... anyone about to perform George Crumb pieces & really anything "inside the piano" must meet with me ahead of time to just go over everything at a Piano (typically THE Piano that will be used if at all possible). 
    I nearly always try to steer them away from the dots (insert cringing Beethoven here...because I just don't care for the dots & they typically fall off/inside Piano.) I could not agree more with the post-it note technique you described. I also normally suggest some of the high quality painter's tapes for this purpose. (And so many colors are now available as well so this seems to go over really well). 
    Honestly, our greatest issue is not with grad students, etc-but with special guest artists tracing around. But I digress...another story for another time.. (grin!!)

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    [Kevin] [Fortenberry] [RPT]
    [Staff Techician]
    [Texas Tech Univ]
    [Lubbock] [TX]
    [8067783962]
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  • 11.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 15:19
    Zeno,, I think that when it was played here, the nodes were shown with a spot of magic marker (though it's hard to remember after this long.) No damage was done, and I removed the marks with a soft eraser, very easily. Maybe you could test on a lesser piano and see how that works for you.

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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  • 12.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-31-2018 15:16
    Yes, about twenty years ago George Crumb was there for the opening of the Bloch Festival, and they had brought in a 6 foot Yamaha rental at the last minute, because it wasn't held at the Arts Center. But the break worked well for Voice of the Whale. Everyone happy. (Appropriate location, too, since whales migratel along the Oregon Coast.)

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    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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  • 13.  RE: George Crumb piece

    Posted 09-01-2018 08:11
    I read with interest about "preparing" pianos. I just wondered if different colored dry erase markers would work for you. Just a thought.


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    Thomas Black
    Decatur AL
    256-350-9315
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