Pianotech

Topic: removing lacquered Kawai lock 

1.  removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 16:29
Greetings all,
I have a rather noisy 1993 Kawai KG-@2A in a church. It suffers from some resonances, kind of a metallic. I've checked every possible loose screw on the piano and case, inside and out. I've damped off strings. All to no avail. It's very possible there is something going on in sanctuary--there's a lot of equipment, including a drum set (surrounded by plexiglass, so I don't think it's the snare on this one). Microphones, all sorts of stuff.

This is probably a long shot, but I'd heard that sometimes the lock springs can be the noise culprit in these pianos. I thought it worth checking, but there's a problem: the lock, including screws, are lacquered over. Is there a way to get this out without making a mess? The piano's not in great condition, but still....I don't want to make it worse. I'm not sure it's a big issue with the music director, especially as the piano is used with a sound system and in a loud environment. Probably bothers me more.


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Scott Cole
Talent OR
541-601-9033
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2.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 16:39
I love my stethoscope.





3.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 16:44
In addition to a mechanic's stethoscope, I would bring a leaf blower to the piano. It can be surprising what blows off the soundboard sometimes.

Alan

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Alan Eder, RPT
Herb Alpert School of Music
California Institute of the Arts
Valencia, CA
661.904.6483
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4.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 16:51
Hi Scott:
It is likely that you will need to refinish the lock bar or stretcher (what the lock it embedded in). You might consider removing the stretcher instead, turn it upside down and stuff the hole with something from underneath there. Removing the plunger and the lock plate will be much more difficult and messy. It can be done, but the finish is either polyester or urethane, and it will be a bit of a hassle to touchup like it didn't happen.
Good luck.
Paul McCloud
San DIego


Greetings all,
I have a rather noisy 1993 Kawai KG-@2A in a church. It suffers from some resonances, kind of a metallic. I've checked every possible loose screw on the piano and case, inside and out. I've damped off strings. All to no avail. It's very possible there is something going on in sanctuary--there's a lot of equipment, including a drum set (surrounded by plexiglass, so I don't think it's the snare on this one). Microphones, all sorts of stuff.

This is probably a long shot, but I'd heard that sometimes the lock springs can be the noise culprit in these pianos. I thought it worth checking, but there's a problem: the lock, including screws, are lacquered over. Is there a way to get this out without making a mess? The piano's not in great condition, but still....I don't want to make it worse. I'm not sure it's a big issue with the music director, especially as the piano is used with a sound system and in a loud environment. Probably bothers me more.


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Scott Cole
Talent OR
541-601-9033





5.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 17:25
I fixed a problem like this in a Petrof and it indeed was the problem. A note in the middle of the piano excited the lock mechanism which was also covered over with a lacquer . I took an exacto knife and carefully cut the material around the perimeter of the lock. Ordered a new lock from Petrof but it was too small. I took the original lock and coated all of the inside metal arms with liquid rubber insulation I got in a can from the electrical section at Home Depot. I believe the key still worked if it was ever used. Presto Changeo the noise was gone...

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James Kelly
Pawleys Island SC
843-325-4357
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6.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 16:53
You could just pull the lid and see if the noise stops.
A plastic hammer with thick felt glued on one face can assist in quick tapping all over the piano, looking for the buzz.

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Ed Sutton
ed440@me.com
(980) 254-7413
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7.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 19:31
Hi Scott,  I've had this one  ......  and it was on a Kawai, however I've slept since then.  I expect Don M (Mr. Schwartz) will chime in on this.  Push on the plunger with a non-marring something or nuther  (wood dowel maybe) and watch what emerges under the stretcher.  Push far enough and you'll see a small screw.  Undo that screw and the entire assembly falls apart, spring and all.  Maybe you don't have to do this.
 
As I recall you can stuff cotton in the hole from above and it will find it's way to the offending noise maker yet still leave the mechanism functional. 
 
Good luck maestro.
 
Lar
 
 
 
 





8.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 21:54
Mr. Schwartz?

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Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
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9.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-03-2018 22:59

Ha!  Mr. Schwartz indeed. ��

 

The lock mechanism does not remove easily, so don't bother trying that.  But you can check the lock plunger very easily – if you push it down a tiny bit and the buzz stops, that's the source!  Here's what to do:

  • Push it down on top with the eraser end of a pencil. Check the screw on the bottom to be sure the little fallboard stop block is tight.
  • Push down again on the plunger, but this time squirt a little wood glue (any kind that is slightly soft – Titebond, PVC-E are both fine) on either side (left and right side) of the plunger top.  The plunger has shoulders underneath that bear up against the underside of the lock plate. Putting some wood glue there stops the buzz quite permanently. It doesn't really stick to the metal, but it does act as a gap filler and cushion, so the plunger won't buzz any more.
  • The long lid hinge is another very common source of cabinet buzzes.  You can verify this by simply lifting the fly leaf and playing – if the buzz stops, you found it! This is best fixed by first tightening all the small screws and fixing any overturned ones.  Then apply linseed oil to the gaps in the hinge – not the small joints between hinge loops, but at the open end of the hinge loops where they have been bent around the pin. Apply a bead of linseed oil there, work the hinge for a minute or so to get the oil worked in, the wipe off any excess.  Linseed oil gums up as it hardens, and will permanently stop the hinge buzzing – I've done this many times now with 100% effectiveness, including on my own piano at home.  Buzz free for about 10 years now!

 

Be cautious with the rags used to clean up linseed oil.  As it hardens it also gets hot, so if soaked paper towels are balled up and thrown away they can catch fire!  It is recommended that you spread rags out to dry someplace safe, then thrown them out after the oil has dried.

 

Good luck with this  The list of potential buzzes in pianos can go on forever, so the other advice I have with a really difficult to find buzz is to have a friend help.    2 piano tuners are definitely better than one in these cases.

 

Don Mannino

Kawai America

 






10.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-04-2018 09:09

The "Amazing Mr. Schwarts" San is correct.
Have implemented this "fix" often  also appropriate on the S&S Boston pianos.
My glue of preference for this is either Elmers school glue ( dries clear) or the titebond molding glue.
Both have similar results.



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Gerry
Gerald P. Cousins, RPT ~ Director of Piano Services and Resources
West Chester University of PA
gcousins@wcupa.edu
cell 301-452-0911
Helping People and Piano Technicians in the US, Japan and Alberta Canada lower and/or totally eliminate a monthly bill via upgrading of a service, subconsciously used and habitually paid. You pay regardless, why not pay less and help others save too? Feel free to ask how and/or if you qualify.
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11.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-04-2018 09:22
Don

This would be a great tip for the Journal - especially with pictures

"PTG - Expand your Horizon - Share the Vision"

"Good, Better, Best.  Never let it rest. "till the good is better, and the better, best."

Bill Davis, RPT, SERVP

2315 Rocky Mountain Rd NE
Marietta GA 30066-2113
CP: 770-778-6881
bill@pianoplace.net
www.pianoplace.net






12.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-05-2018 10:25
Thanks all for the suggestions. Good to know I don't have to remove that lock.
Scott

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Scott Cole
Talent OR
541-601-9033
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13.  RE: removing lacquered Kawai lock

Posted 01-05-2018 11:21
Hemp seed oil is another choice that gums up with age.

Joe Wiencek