Pianotech

  • 1.  PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Posted 02-09-2020 12:51
    So received a piano with the old Pianodisc 128plus installed. Seems for the moment all connections in order.
    I am trying to test the product but the controller turns on OK but immediately powers off/shuts down down when I insert a disc . . any ideas why?

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    Stephen K
    Harrison NY
    555-1212
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  • 2.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-09-2020 13:32
    Is the controller plugged into switched or un switched outlet?

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    Larry Messerly, RPT
    Bringing Harmony to Homes
    www.lacrossepianotuning.com
    ljmesserly@gmail.com
    928-899-7292
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    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Posted 02-09-2020 13:43
    Plugged into a traditional unswitched outlet. The unit powers on but immediately shut when disc inserted. Unit doesn't even power on when power button pressed.

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    Stephen K
    Harrison NY
    555-1212
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    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-09-2020 16:10
    I don't have a magic bullet here for you but from what you're telling us, the added current demand of the disk drive is using all the current available to keep the control box turned on.  Current requires wire diameter.  If there's a frayed connection, partial connection or a loose connection somewhere, you'll get this condition.  On the 128's, plus or no plus, the cable that runs from the power supply to the control box has a silver ring that JUST fits in the MIDI looking socket labeled "power" or "to power".  This ring can look OK but actually is loose.  This happens when side pressure is wrongly applied while it's plugged into the socket.  That ring is a ground as I recall.  If it's loose, you'll have this symptom.  See if you can find a replacement cable and swap it out. 

    Additionally, and along these same lines, check the chassis mounted socket for slop.  It is screwed to the panel it's mounted to so It should not have any play in it al all. 

    Look at the male end of things in the cable.  All the pins should be perfectly lined up with each other.  It they're every which way, there's been some mishandling of the cable.  Swap it out.

    Check the cable for damage to the insulation/sleeve/outer parts.  Any obvious damage should show some bare wire.  Maybe a pinched cable would do this and you'd see the resulting damage to the outer cover of the cable.

    Long story short, find a replacement cable and swap it out as part of a troubleshooting procedure.

    Is there a chance the line voltage is failing?  Take along a heavy extension cord and plug the unit into a different circuit in the house.  If the plug socket is not wired securely you'll have a drop in voltage as the increase in current is sensed.  If that circuit powers up a space heater without any issues, it's probably OK.

    20 years ago I had this symptom but I can't remember any fixes.  I think it was usually the cable that ran from the control box to the power supply.


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    Larry Fisher
    Owner, Chief Grunt, Head Hosehead
    Vancouver WA
    503-310-6965
    Working the gravy zone for the rest of my days.
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    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Posted 02-12-2020 16:16
    Fantastic - I will look

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    Stephen K
    Harrison NY
    555-1212
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    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-18-2020 10:05
    One more thing I thought of  .....  when things shut down, does the power supply under the piano shut off as well?  If so, it's the wall circuit.  In not, it's most likely the cable.

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    Larry Fisher
    Owner, Chief Grunt, Head Hosehead
    Vancouver WA
    503-310-6965
    Working the gravy zone for the rest of my days.
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    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Posted 02-18-2020 13:03
    Interesting. The power block does not shut down so may be that pesky cable.


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    Stephen K
    Harrison NY
    555-1212
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    Original Message


  • 8.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Member
    Posted 02-18-2020 14:53
    Cables are often the culprit because of the many wires in the connector ends that can get twisted/stressed. If the player unit is getting juice from the power supply which it sounds like it is there may be a  problem with the power to drive the solenoid boards and solenoids. take some pictures of the power supply and the cable connections in and out of it and either post them or pm me if the problem is the player unit and you can get (as in borrow) another player unit that works to swap out you will know right away its a bad player unit. if there is a test button on the processor unit and notes play chromatically up from the bottom you will know the driver boards are good.  Cables can be a real headache but you need to find out which ones are bad. A certified Piano Disc technician can take voltage readings off the power supply which must be within certain ranges. The large car battery sized power supply has been replaced by a newer two piece power supply one which is like a small transformer/charger and the other which is the size of a large external hard disk in a case . The  cables have adapters however you have to make sure the correct cables are ordered for the particular equipment you have.   Be aware that a new power supply is quite expensive and needs to be purchased through a certified Piano Disc Installer/technician

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    James Kelly
    Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
    Pawleys Island SC
    843-325-4357
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    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Posted 02-19-2020 21:21
    Thanks for this. I have an old system that came with piano (old power block) Power seems to work initially but as I said once old floppy diskette it shuts down
    Where can I get this 6pin DIN to 6 pin DIN cable? Dose not seem to be readily available  . .any place online?

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    Stephen K
    Harrison NY
    555-1212
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    Original Message


  • 10.  RE: PianoDisc Problem - Disc Shutdown

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-20-2020 10:38

    Trouble shooting electronics can entail many levels of knowledge.  Balancing the cost between trying a few things yourself or calling a specialist is sometimes an art.  A cable is a low cost tool every PD tech should have in their trouble shooting kit.  A DVM can act like special goggles to help see what's going on.  There are other clues to work with that knowledge of the system can bring you to a viable course of action.  Personally I've never had to pull out my DVM with these things more because I'm lazy than anything.  LED's and physical movement have been my indicator I guess.

    I like Mr. Kelly's suggestion about the test button.  If you have THAT version of the CPU board, (with the control box on and idle) press that button and see what happens.  If you get a loud chromatic scale, you've got plenty of solenoid power (the heavy cable that is hard wired to the CPU board but reverse plugged at the p/s).  If the control box shuts off, there's a problem (most likely) with the p/s.  If the dog dons a cape and flies out the window, you should leave the house immediately because it's about to explode into a ball of carbon particles.  So don't ever press that button again.

    "What's the CPU board?" you ask.  Crawl under the bass end of the piano and look at the long and skinny sheet metal rail cover.  There's a place where lots of cables are either attached (hard wired) or plugged in.  One of those cables is plugged into the "power" or "to control box" or some such thing.  Oh wait.  I think it says both of those things.  The short one that goes to the control box.  That's the cable you want to replace first.  When sitting idle there's an LED that's probably green, but it may be red.  As long as it's lit up, you've got power.  When playing, or the control box is generating digital traffic (reading a disk), the LED labeled "data" blinks.  When the sustain pedal is being activated, the LED labeled "pedal" lights up.  Ah geez, from memory there's a cable that looks similar that runs from the p/s to the CPU board.  A shorter version of this cable goes from the CPU board to the control box.  (slowly this stuff comes back to me)

    When these things are moved, sometimes the control box is removed.  When reinstalled damage occurs if done wrong.  Additionally, if the control box isn't removed or unplugged, a moving strap or other piano moving forces are applied to these cables and damage occurs.

    The similarly looking cable that goes from the CPU board to the p/s has 12 volts of control voltage and 6 volts of logic voltage or something close to that.  Obviously I've gotten this far without having to remember this stuff very well but it's good knowledge to have (or so I'm told).

    I'd expect PD has a cable for you.  If they're no longer available PM me and I'll get up out of my chair and see if I have one for you.  Be sure to include the length needed.  There's a 3 foot version and a longer one (I think).

    First cup of coffee, olde brain, retired attitude.

    Lar



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    Larry Fisher
    Owner, Chief Grunt, Head Hosehead
    Vancouver WA
    503-310-6965
    Working the gravy zone for the rest of my days.
    ------------------------------

    Original Message