Pianotech

Hi Corey,
are they using any particular kind of cleaner to clean the key tops?
when in a customer's home, i always use the medium thick or thick CA super glue and i have not ever had a problem with those key tops coming off again
Peter

------------------------------
Petrus Janssen
Peachtree City GA
678-416-8055
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 09:43
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

I've had some loose keytops on a Yamaha P22 lately. I use Pianotek's Roo Glue which gives you some time to position the top carefully. My experience with CA is that you have to clamp to be sure it will stay and you have to clamp quickly before it dries. I find the Roo Glue easier, though it does usually involve wiping up some squeeze-out.

------------------------------
John Pope
University of Kentucky School of Music
Lexington, KY
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 09:43
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

Is the player using some kind of hand lotion?  Are they "disinfecting" the keys with something?

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 11:31
From: John Pope
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I've had some loose keytops on a Yamaha P22 lately. I use Pianotek's Roo Glue which gives you some time to position the top carefully. My experience with CA is that you have to clamp to be sure it will stay and you have to clamp quickly before it dries. I find the Roo Glue easier, though it does usually involve wiping up some squeeze-out.

------------------------------
John Pope
University of Kentucky School of Music
Lexington, KY

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 09:43
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

Hmmm, in the case of my P22 there certainly was a lot of "disinfecting" over the past year. It didn't effect the other 80 or so pianos this way though.

------------------------------
John Pope
University of Kentucky School of Music
Lexington, KY
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 11:40
From: Jon Page
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

Is the player using some kind of hand lotion?  Are they "disinfecting" the keys with something?

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 11:31
From: John Pope
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I've had some loose keytops on a Yamaha P22 lately. I use Pianotek's Roo Glue which gives you some time to position the top carefully. My experience with CA is that you have to clamp to be sure it will stay and you have to clamp quickly before it dries. I find the Roo Glue easier, though it does usually involve wiping up some squeeze-out.

------------------------------
John Pope
University of Kentucky School of Music
Lexington, KY

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 09:43
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

You may need to install a performance lock to restrict access.Maybe someone enjoys tickling the ivories or perhaps someone damages it on purpose because they do not like piano music. If you are not scraping the old glue off both the keystick and the keytop the glue could be failing. Not using a clamp and using glue that been exposed to cold or heat can result in glue failure . Some glues also have an expiration date- check on the bottom . Finally contact the Yamaha tech support line but have the serial number handy. I would think this is an isolated incident or more of us would be coming across it

------------------------------
James Kelly
Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
Pawleys Island SC
843-325-4357
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 12:19
From: John Pope
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

Hmmm, in the case of my P22 there certainly was a lot of "disinfecting" over the past year. It didn't effect the other 80 or so pianos this way though.

------------------------------
John Pope
University of Kentucky School of Music
Lexington, KY

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 11:40
From: Jon Page
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

Is the player using some kind of hand lotion?  Are they "disinfecting" the keys with something?

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 11:31
From: John Pope
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I've had some loose keytops on a Yamaha P22 lately. I use Pianotek's Roo Glue which gives you some time to position the top carefully. My experience with CA is that you have to clamp to be sure it will stay and you have to clamp quickly before it dries. I find the Roo Glue easier, though it does usually involve wiping up some squeeze-out.

------------------------------
John Pope
University of Kentucky School of Music
Lexington, KY

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 09:43
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

Original Message:
Sent: 9/2/2021 6:40:00 PM
From: James Kelly
Subject: RE: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

You may need to install a performance lock to restrict access.Maybe someone enjoys tickling the ivories or perhaps someone damages it on purpose because they do not like piano music. If you are not scraping the old glue off both the keystick and the keytop the glue could be failing. Not using a clamp and using glue that been exposed to cold or heat can result in glue failure . Some glues also have an expiration date- check on the bottom . Finally contact the Yamaha tech support line but have the serial number handy. I would think this is an isolated incident or more of us would be coming across it

------------------------------
James Kelly
Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
Pawleys Island SC
843-325-4357
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 12:19
From: John Pope
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

Hmmm, in the case of my P22 there certainly was a lot of "disinfecting" over the past year. It didn't effect the other 80 or so pianos this way though.

------------------------------
John Pope
University of Kentucky School of Music
Lexington, KY

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 11:40
From: Jon Page
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

Is the player using some kind of hand lotion?  Are they "disinfecting" the keys with something?

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 11:31
From: John Pope
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I've had some loose keytops on a Yamaha P22 lately. I use Pianotek's Roo Glue which gives you some time to position the top carefully. My experience with CA is that you have to clamp to be sure it will stay and you have to clamp quickly before it dries. I find the Roo Glue easier, though it does usually involve wiping up some squeeze-out.

------------------------------
John Pope
University of Kentucky School of Music
Lexington, KY

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 09:43
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

Call Yamaha with the serial number to make sure there's not a known issue.

This year, I had two fairly new pianos with a significant number of keys that came unglued. One was a 2019 Yamaha P22, and the other was a 2013 Kawai UST-9. It was obvious there was a glue failure.

Yamaha paid me to replace, and Kawai wanted me to send them somewhere to be replaced.

------------------------------
John Formsma, RPT
New Albany MS

Slow the spread. Stop the mass vaccination during a pandemic.
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-02-2021 09:43
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

I have found superglue to be too inflexible, Corey. Humidity change can break the bond. I carry contact cement for situations where there isn’t time for a glue that requires clamping and a longer curing time. In my piano at home I use PVC-E and leave it clamped for 24 hours.

Bob Anderson, RPT
Tucson, AZ


Original Message:
Sent: 9/2/2021 9:44:00 AM
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

Original Message:
Sent: 9/3/2021 7:30:00 AM
From: Robert Anderson
Subject: RE: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I have found superglue to be too inflexible, Corey. Humidity change can break the bond. I carry contact cement for situations where there isn’t time for a glue that requires clamping and a longer curing time. In my piano at home I use PVC-E and leave it clamped for 24 hours.

Bob Anderson, RPT
Tucson, AZ


Original Message:
Sent: 9/2/2021 9:44:00 AM
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

Contact Yamaha. There was a spate of recent pianos that had a problem with the glue, and it is a warranty issue.

Joe Wiencek
NYC


Original Message:
Sent: 9/2/2021 9:44:00 AM
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims

Original Message:
Sent: 9/3/2021 3:36:00 PM
From: Joe Wiencek
Subject: RE: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

Contact Yamaha. There was a spate of recent pianos that had a problem with the glue, and it is a warranty issue.

Joe Wiencek
NYC


Original Message:
Sent: 9/2/2021 9:44:00 AM
From: Corey Sims
Subject: Keytops keep coming unglued on piano

I am trying to understand why a particular, in fairly nice condition, Yamaha C-2 small grand keeps having keytop issues.   I have used superglue (JB Weld was the last kind) and the tops hold for a while (maybe even a year) but the last time I serviced the piano, a majority of the keytops were at least partially unglued with the front being loose and the back still connected.  It is located in a large dining room at a retirement home. I don't know who else plays it so maybe somebody has a strange technique where they brush upwards once in a while.  My technique is to just apply some glue and position the keytop, push down on it, and hope it works, which it usually does on other pianos.  Maybe a different glue would work that takes a little longer to set and then sets just as strong (in case I need to reposition it)  I appreciate any advice.

Corey Sims