Pianotech

On the high treble portion of the soundboard (grands) there is a roughly 12" long piece of trim screwed to the edge. It is beveled on the bottom edge and glued.

Can someone explain to me:

1)  What is it's function (other than decoration)?

2)  Why is it beveled on the bottom?

3) How long has it been part of the SS design?

I don't think all grands have this feature (or at least precisely the same). 

Thx

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Don't know about the bevel, but the screwing the treble shelf down makes sense, as, if you have ever glued down a board, the treble shelf does not want to go down to the rim easily. The upward stresses in the board at glueup, focus on this area following the shape of the bridge. 



------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 02-21-2020 18:35
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

On the high treble portion of the soundboard (grands) there is a roughly 12" long piece of trim screwed to the edge. It is beveled on the bottom edge and glued.

Can someone explain to me:

1)  What is it's function (other than decoration)?

2)  Why is it beveled on the bottom?

3) How long has it been part of the SS design?

I don't think all grands have this feature (or at least precisely the same).

Thx

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

My understanding is that it creates a stronger joint, and that the angle is to make a larger glue surface.  The concern must have been the narrowness of the rim up there.
-chris

------------------------------
If it's pinging, it's not singing, it's just ringing,
chernobieffpiano.com
grandpianoman@protonmail.com
Knoxville, TN
865-986-7720
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 02-21-2020 18:49
From: Jim Ialeggio
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

Don't know about the bevel, but the screwing the treble shelf down makes sense, as, if you have ever glued down a board, the treble shelf does not want to go down to the rim easily. The upward stresses in the board at glueup, focus on this area following the shape of the bridge.



------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026

Original Message:
Sent: 02-21-2020 18:35
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

On the high treble portion of the soundboard (grands) there is a roughly 12" long piece of trim screwed to the edge. It is beveled on the bottom edge and glued.

Can someone explain to me:

1)  What is it's function (other than decoration)?

2)  Why is it beveled on the bottom?

3) How long has it been part of the SS design?

I don't think all grands have this feature (or at least precisely the same).

Thx

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

I spent a week at steinway when Scott Jones was teaching there. He pointed out this feature out when we watched a soundboard being installed as being very important to the structural integrity of the board. After 25 years I don’t remember the details, perhaps someone else does. There must have been at least 200 techs that attended those classes every year.

Rob

Robert Edwardsen
Registered Piano Technician
PO Box 334
Pittsford NY 14534
585-586-1360
edwardsenpianoservice.com
eedward2@rochester.rr.com


Original Message------

On the high treble portion of the soundboard (grands) there is a roughly 12" long piece of trim screwed to the edge. It is beveled on the bottom edge and glued.

Can someone explain to me:

1)  What is it's function (other than decoration)?

2)  Why is it beveled on the bottom?

3) How long has it been part of the SS design?

I don't think all grands have this feature (or at least precisely the same). 

Thx

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Reading Mario’s book, he describes the hardwood bevel acting to clamp the board and cover the end grain in order to better reflect the vibrations from the soundboard. It seems to be from the 1870s.

Joe Wiencek


Original Message------

On the high treble portion of the soundboard (grands) there is a roughly 12" long piece of trim screwed to the edge. It is beveled on the bottom edge and glued.

Can someone explain to me:

1)  What is it's function (other than decoration)?

2)  Why is it beveled on the bottom?

3) How long has it been part of the SS design?

I don't think all grands have this feature (or at least precisely the same). 

Thx

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Original Message------

Reading Mario’s book, he describes the hardwood bevel acting to clamp the board and cover the end grain in order to better reflect the vibrations from the soundboard. It seems to be from the 1870s.

Joe Wiencek

This reeks of BS, as usual. How about taking some empirical evidence regarding S&S high trebles. They can be as wooden as any other high treble, and, infact, unless hammer weight, hammer strike point shape, strike point are correct, the high treble is wooden knocks, in this or any other treble. Said differently, the things that make a high sustain high treble have nothing to do with the shape of the piece screwed on to the shelf.   

The standard Steinway MO...Invent a bullshit physical attribute, don't back it up with any evidence, produce inconsistent to shitty high trebles, and then promote this amazing attribute as yet another example of the resplendent Theodore's transcendent and exclusive knowledge of higher being.


------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 02-23-2020 10:34
From: Chris Chernobieff
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

Is there any documented testing results that prove that having the bevel to block the endgrain of spruce reflects the soundboard vibrations? 

-chris

Chernobieff Piano Restorations

Chris Chernobieff ( pronounced chur-no-bif )

Lenoir City, Tennessee 
email: chrisppff@gmail.com

web: chernobieffpiano.com

Follow on:  Facebook

phone: 865-986-7720

 

 

 

Original Message------

Reading Mario's book, he describes the hardwood bevel acting to clamp the board and cover the end grain in order to better reflect the vibrations from the soundboard. It seems to be from the 1870s.

Joe Wiencek

Hey Jim, tell us how you really feel.

------------------------------
Steven Rosenthal
Honolulu HI
808-521-7129
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 02-23-2020 10:58
From: Jim Ialeggio
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

This reeks of BS, as usual. How about taking some empirical evidence regarding S&S high trebles. They can be as wooden as any other high treble, and, infact, unless hammer weight, hammer strike point shape, strike point are correct, the high treble is wooden knocks, in this or any other treble. Said differently, the things that make a high sustain high treble have nothing to do with the shape of the piece screwed on to the shelf.

The standard Steinway MO...Invent a bullshit physical attribute, don't back it up with any evidence, produce inconsistent to shitty high trebles, and then promote this amazing attribute as yet another example of the resplendent Theodore's transcendent and exclusive knowledge of higher being.


------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026

Original Message:
Sent: 02-23-2020 10:34
From: Chris Chernobieff
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

Is there any documented testing results that prove that having the bevel to block the endgrain of spruce reflects the soundboard vibrations? 

-chris

Chernobieff Piano Restorations

Chris Chernobieff ( pronounced chur-no-bif )

Lenoir City, Tennessee 
email: chrisppff@gmail.com

web: chernobieffpiano.com

Follow on:  Facebook

phone: 865-986-7720

 

 

 

Original Message------

Reading Mario's book, he describes the hardwood bevel acting to clamp the board and cover the end grain in order to better reflect the vibrations from the soundboard. It seems to be from the 1870s.

Joe Wiencek

ok...I'm just getting started!

------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 02-23-2020 16:03
From: Steven Rosenthal
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

Hey Jim, tell us how you really feel.

------------------------------
Steven Rosenthal
Honolulu HI
808-521-7129

Original Message:
Sent: 02-23-2020 10:58
From: Jim Ialeggio
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

This reeks of BS, as usual. How about taking some empirical evidence regarding S&S high trebles. They can be as wooden as any other high treble, and, infact, unless hammer weight, hammer strike point shape, strike point are correct, the high treble is wooden knocks, in this or any other treble. Said differently, the things that make a high sustain high treble have nothing to do with the shape of the piece screwed on to the shelf.

The standard Steinway MO...Invent a bullshit physical attribute, don't back it up with any evidence, produce inconsistent to shitty high trebles, and then promote this amazing attribute as yet another example of the resplendent Theodore's transcendent and exclusive knowledge of higher being.


------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026

Original Message:
Sent: 02-23-2020 10:34
From: Chris Chernobieff
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

Is there any documented testing results that prove that having the bevel to block the endgrain of spruce reflects the soundboard vibrations? 

-chris

Chernobieff Piano Restorations

Chris Chernobieff ( pronounced chur-no-bif )

Lenoir City, Tennessee 
email: chrisppff@gmail.com

web: chernobieffpiano.com

Follow on:  Facebook

phone: 865-986-7720

 

 

 

Original Message------

Reading Mario's book, he describes the hardwood bevel acting to clamp the board and cover the end grain in order to better reflect the vibrations from the soundboard. It seems to be from the 1870s.

Joe Wiencek

Original Message------

Hey Jim, tell us how you really feel.

------------------------------
Steven Rosenthal
Honolulu HI
808-521-7129
------------------------------

I don't know about blocking vibrations from running out of the end grain but the story is the factory guys did a fair amount of experimenting with and without the beveled block and preferred the top end with the block. Easier to do when you are building a few thousand pianos a year than experimenting with a few redesigns a year in which you are changing all sorts of elements making isolating the effects of any one feature impossible  

i don't think I'd dismiss the choice to do it as complete bull shit. As to why it might improve things I can't be sure. Certainly improved clamping of the board to the thin belly rail isn't a bad idea. The hard maple piece might add some density and mass there that might have an effect. Beveling the board would result in a larger piece of maple trim FWIW. 

I always duplicate that feature and reuse the original piece. To arbitrarily discard it seems a bit arrogant. 

------------------------------
David Love RPT
www.davidlovepianos.com
davidlovepianos@comcast.net
415 407 8320
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 02-23-2020 10:34
From: Chris Chernobieff
Subject: Steinway treble soundboard trim

Is there any documented testing results that prove that having the bevel to block the endgrain of spruce reflects the soundboard vibrations? 

-chris

Chernobieff Piano Restorations

Chris Chernobieff ( pronounced chur-no-bif )

Lenoir City, Tennessee 
email: chrisppff@gmail.com

web: chernobieffpiano.com

Follow on:  Facebook

phone: 865-986-7720

Original Message------

Reading Mario's book, he describes the hardwood bevel acting to clamp the board and cover the end grain in order to better reflect the vibrations from the soundboard. It seems to be from the 1870s.

Joe Wiencek