Hi, Peter,
Spot on.
Kind regards.
Horace
On 1/6/2019 7:24 PM, Peter Grey via Piano Technicians Guild wrote:
> Please do not forward this message due to Auto Login.
>
> Terry,
>
> I'm speaking more in a legal sense than anything else.
>
> "The Letter" mentioned misinformation propagated (in essence) by rebuilders who use non-Steinway parts, etc. However, I am highlighting the fact that Steinway itself is propagating misinformation by touting its "Restoration Department" as THE one and only place to truly restore a Steinway piano. How is this?
>
> As I stated, they remanufacture the pianos according to 2018/2019 thinking and specs, regardless of what specs (and the reasoning for them) went into that 1917 (or whatever) instrument. If a client says: "I want my mother's piano to pay and sound as much as possible as it did in 1917" (for instance), Steinway is NOT going to do this.?? They have a protocol that they apply to each piano and you take it or leave it. Whereas if the client says the same to many of us (including you) who like to listen to them, we have many alternate "tools, tweaks, and materials" available to us to achieve what the client is asking...hammers, wire, geometry, and other true restoration techniques that we have learned and perfected so as to reproduce that 1917 sound and feel more authentically BECAUSE we are not locked into a "take it or leave it" mentality.
>
> There is value in being able to do this and do it well. It's not always about the "latest and the greatest", but rather the ability to recreate what WAS, if that is what the client wants. This is what we specialize in, and Steinway does not. They want to force everyone into a predetermined mold (today's mold). That is NOT restoration (at least in my book).?? Anyone is free to disagree with this point of view, but I have seen the emotional reaction of family members too many times to set this aside in favor of what is basically a "new" piano (which is what Steinway does) for which they could just go buy a new one and get the same thing (but that's not what they want).
>
> Does this make any sense? Or am I just gibber jabbering? At this point I'm not sure.
>
> Pwg
>
> ------------------------------
> Peter Grey
> Stratham NH
> 603-686-2395
>
pianodoctor57@gmail.com> ------------------------------
> -------------------------------------------
> Original Message:
> Sent: 01-06-2019 15:18
> From: Terrence Farrell
> Subject: Rebuilder Decal Options
>
> Peter G. wrote: "...Steinway does not "restore" any pianos. They "remanufacture" them to current 2018 specs and dimensions. They literally throw away everything except the case and plate, and start all over again with CURRENT stuff. There is NO effort to keep any of the original historicity of the instrument, therefore THEY are deceiving the public by their use of the term "restoration".
>
> Many of us OTOH actually try to restore as much of the original design as possible. Even with a new soundboard, many (though not all) literally duplicate the original design of that instrument, which falls more in line with "restoration" than "remanufacturing"."
>
> I'm not sure I follow regarding a Steinway soundboard. How does a 2018 spec S&S soundboard installed during a remanufacture in the S&S factory differ from the original (well, except perhaps, the tapering of the panel)?
>
>
> Terry Farrell
>
> ------------------------------
> Terry Farrell
> Farrell Piano Service, Inc.
> Brandon, Florida
>
terry@farrellpiano.com <
terry@farrellpiano.com>
> 813-684-3505
> ------------------------------
>
> Original Message:
> Sent: 01-05-2019 12:20
> From: Peter Grey
> Subject: Rebuilder Decal Options
>
> I've been thinking about this again (always a bit precarious) and I realized...Steinway does not "restore" any pianos. They "remanufacture" them to current 2018 specs and dimensions. They literally throw away everything except the case and plate, and start all over again with CURRENT stuff. There is NO effort to keep any of the original historicity of the instrument, therefore THEY are deceiving the public by their use of the term "restoration".
>
> Many of us OTOH actually try to restore as much of the original design as possible. Even with a new soundboard, many (though not all) literally duplicate the original design of that instrument, which falls more in line with "restoration" than "remanufacturing".
>
> So, who's deceiving who?
>
> I wonder what a judge would say?
>
> Pwg
>
> ------------------------------
> Peter Grey
> Stratham NH
> 603-686-2395
>
pianodoctor57@gmail.com <
pianodoctor57@gmail.com>
>
> Original Message:
> Sent: 01-04-2019 20:30
> From: Chris Chernobieff
> Subject: Rebuilder Decal Options
>
> I'm curious if Steinway's restoration shop will just restore fallboards? Chernobieff Piano Restorations
> Chris Chernobieff ( pronounced chur-no-bif )Lenoir City, Tennessee
> email:
chrisppff@gmail.com <
chrisppff@gmail.com>web: chernobieffpiano.com <http://chernobieffpiano.com>
> Follow on: Facebook <https://www.facebook.com/ChernobieffPianoandHarpsichordMFG/>
> phone: 865-986-7720
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Original Message------
>
> David (Love),
>
> In addition to your fine assessment of the situation, I would bring in the fact that once a manufacturer's warranty has expired (ANY manufactured product anywhere) they have absolutely NO MORE SAY whatsoever in what happens to it. The owner is free to do what they want with it and the manufacturer has no recourse of any kind. In fact, usually they will disavow any further connection with it BECAUSE of the expired warranty.
>
> If anyone doubts this, just try contacting the manufacturer about a problem after expiration. See what they say.
>
> They only care when they are on the hook for a possible expenditure. After that, they couldn't care less what you do.
>
> Therefore, any Steinway owner, whether they are a consumer, tech, dealer, or whatever, is free to do as they want (short of fraud obviously). The manufacturer cannot come back 100 years later and demand or require anything to do with that piano. Its totally absurd.
>
> Pwg
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Peter Grey
> Stratham NH
> 603-686-2395
>
pianodoctor57@gmail.com <
pianodoctor57@gmail.com>
> ------------------------------
>
>
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Original Message------
Terry,
I'm speaking more in a legal sense than anything else.
"The Letter" mentioned misinformation propagated (in essence) by rebuilders who use non-Steinway parts, etc. However, I am highlighting the fact that Steinway itself is propagating misinformation by touting its "Restoration Department" as THE one and only place to truly restore a Steinway piano. How is this?
As I stated, they remanufacture the pianos according to 2018/2019 thinking and specs, regardless of what specs (and the reasoning for them) went into that 1917 (or whatever) instrument. If a client says: "I want my mother's piano to play and sound as much as possible as it did in 1917" (for instance), Steinway is NOT going to do this. They have a protocol that they apply to each piano and you take it or leave it. Whereas if the client says the same to many of us (including you) who like to listen to them, we have many alternate "tools, tweaks, and materials" available to us to achieve what the client is asking...hammers, wire, geometry, and other true restoration techniques that we have learned and perfected so as to reproduce that 1917 sound and feel more authentically BECAUSE we are not locked into a "take it or leave it" mentality.
There is value in being able to do this and do it well. It's not always about the "latest and the greatest", but rather the ability to recreate what WAS, if that is what the client wants. This is what we specialize in, and Steinway does not. They want to force everyone into a predetermined mold (today's mold). That is NOT restoration (at least in my book). Anyone is free to disagree with this point of view, but I have seen the emotional reaction of family members too many times to set this aside in favor of what is basically a "new" piano (which is what Steinway does) for which they could just go buy a new one and get the same thing (but that's not what they want).
Does this make any sense? Or am I just gibber jabbering? At this point I'm not sure.
Pwg
------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------
Original Message:
Sent: 01-06-2019 15:18
From: Terrence Farrell
Subject: Rebuilder Decal Options
Peter G. wrote: "...Steinway does not "restore" any pianos. They "remanufacture" them to current 2018 specs and dimensions. They literally throw away everything except the case and plate, and start all over again with CURRENT stuff. There is NO effort to keep any of the original historicity of the instrument, therefore THEY are deceiving the public by their use of the term "restoration".
Many of us OTOH actually try to restore as much of the original design as possible. Even with a new soundboard, many (though not all) literally duplicate the original design of that instrument, which falls more in line with "restoration" than "remanufacturing"."
I'm not sure I follow regarding a Steinway soundboard. How does a 2018 spec S&S soundboard installed during a remanufacture in the S&S factory differ from the original (well, except perhaps, the tapering of the panel)?
Terry Farrell
------------------------------
Terry Farrell
Farrell Piano Service, Inc.
Brandon, Florida
terry@farrellpiano.com
813-684-3505
Original Message:
Sent: 01-05-2019 12:20
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Rebuilder Decal Options
I've been thinking about this again (always a bit precarious) and I realized...Steinway does not "restore" any pianos. They "remanufacture" them to current 2018 specs and dimensions. They literally throw away everything except the case and plate, and start all over again with CURRENT stuff. There is NO effort to keep any of the original historicity of the instrument, therefore THEY are deceiving the public by their use of the term "restoration".
Many of us OTOH actually try to restore as much of the original design as possible. Even with a new soundboard, many (though not all) literally duplicate the original design of that instrument, which falls more in line with "restoration" than "remanufacturing".
So, who's deceiving who?
I wonder what a judge would say?
Pwg
------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
Original Message:
Sent: 01-04-2019 20:30
From: Chris Chernobieff
Subject: Rebuilder Decal Options
I'm curious if Steinway's restoration shop will just restore fallboards?
Chernobieff Piano Restorations
Chris Chernobieff ( pronounced chur-no-bif )
phone: 865-986-7720
Original Message------
David (Love),
In addition to your fine assessment of the situation, I would bring in the fact that once a manufacturer's warranty has expired (ANY manufactured product anywhere) they have absolutely NO MORE SAY whatsoever in what happens to it. The owner is free to do what they want with it and the manufacturer has no recourse of any kind. In fact, usually they will disavow any further connection with it BECAUSE of the expired warranty.
If anyone doubts this, just try contacting the manufacturer about a problem after expiration. See what they say.
They only care when they are on the hook for a possible expenditure. After that, they couldn't care less what you do.
Therefore, any Steinway owner, whether they are a consumer, tech, dealer, or whatever, is free to do as they want (short of fraud obviously). The manufacturer cannot come back 100 years later and demand or require anything to do with that piano. Its totally absurd.
Pwg
------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------