Pianotech

I know this subject has been dealt with here before but this is slightly different. 

A propane fired "fireplace"unit backed up and blew soot all over the house and particularly in the room where the piano is (piano located right next to the unit). This happened approximately two years ago.  I am just now looking at it. The owner says that she could wipe her finger in the debris on the plate and it came up black. 

However, at this time there seems to be very little residue there. There is no smell. There is dust of course, but what happened to all the soot? Where did it go? No cleaning of any sort has happened in the piano, whereas significant black crud was cleaned off the walls and furniture. 

Is it possible that it has been somehow absorbed into the wiid and metal parts? If so, is this an issue that requires complete replacement of these parts? Or can it just be cleaned up like dust?

Does anyone know, or have some insight on this? I need to decide whether to just clean it, or rebuild it. 

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Peter: Soot is poison. It has the same carincogenic substance as tobacco
smoke and roofing tar.

It is good news that the owner had the house cleaned.

I hope that was done by an expert in dealing with hazardous materials.
Soot is only slightly less dangerous than asbestos.

I would ask the owner if she had the piano cleaned also.

Maybe she did.

If the piano was closed at the time of the event, maybe only a little
soot entered the action.

The only good news I have is that soot is most dangerous when you breathe
it in.

If she had the whole place cleaned thoroughly, it was then that she and
whoever cleaned it for her would have been exposed.

I would look carefully INSIDE the piano. If a little soot is left inside
it is probably safe to use a wet rag or paper towel to remove the stuff.

Soot consists of incredibly tiny particles, so getting it on your skin is
not a good idea either.

Wet cleaning wearing gloves and getting rid of the rags is the way to go.

Whatever you do, do NOT vacuum the piano until you have wet cleaned it.

Hank Mooney
San Francisco


Original Message:
Sent: 9/25/2020 6:26:00 PM
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Soot question (again)

I know this subject has been dealt with here before but this is slightly different. 

A propane fired "fireplace"unit backed up and blew soot all over the house and particularly in the room where the piano is (piano located right next to the unit). This happened approximately two years ago.  I am just now looking at it. The owner says that she could wipe her finger in the debris on the plate and it came up black. 

However, at this time there seems to be very little residue there. There is no smell. There is dust of course, but what happened to all the soot? Where did it go? No cleaning of any sort has happened in the piano, whereas significant black crud was cleaned off the walls and furniture. 

Is it possible that it has been somehow absorbed into the wiid and metal parts? If so, is this an issue that requires complete replacement of these parts? Or can it just be cleaned up like dust?

Does anyone know, or have some insight on this? I need to decide whether to just clean it, or rebuild it. 

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Having had a shop fire with $120k of soot damage (no structural damage), I have noticed in the first years, after the cleanup, that the nasty smell of soot seems to have a half life or something like that. Ozone I think also breaks down chemical bonds in the soot, but time and oxidation (I guess) seems to really do the job for good. So I think its reasonable to guess that the apparently disappearing soot is in fact disappearing very gradually, as chemical bonds are broken or weakened.

Also, re the customer's situation, a gas back draft is different than an actual fire, where bad things like plastic (chlorine) are vaporized. So their soot was probably not that chemically active to start with. In our shop fire, we were able to save all the machines and motors, by acting quick, with a machinery recovery specialist to neutralize the nasty soot. In our case the plastic content was not off the deep end, so though the soot was chemically active, it was not irremediably so...nasty stuff...except on sausages, steak, ribs pork loin...

------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-25-2020 19:32
From: Henry Mooney
Subject: Soot question (again)

Peter: Soot is poison. It has the same carincogenic substance as tobacco
smoke and roofing tar.

It is good news that the owner had the house cleaned.

I hope that was done by an expert in dealing with hazardous materials.
Soot is only slightly less dangerous than asbestos.

I would ask the owner if she had the piano cleaned also.

Maybe she did.

If the piano was closed at the time of the event, maybe only a little
soot entered the action.

The only good news I have is that soot is most dangerous when you breathe
it in.

If she had the whole place cleaned thoroughly, it was then that she and
whoever cleaned it for her would have been exposed.

I would look carefully INSIDE the piano. If a little soot is left inside
it is probably safe to use a wet rag or paper towel to remove the stuff.

Soot consists of incredibly tiny particles, so getting it on your skin is
not a good idea either.

Wet cleaning wearing gloves and getting rid of the rags is the way to go.

Whatever you do, do NOT vacuum the piano until you have wet cleaned it.

Hank Mooney
San Francisco


Original Message:
Sent: 9/25/2020 6:26:00 PM
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Soot question (again)

I know this subject has been dealt with here before but this is slightly different.

A propane fired "fireplace"unit backed up and blew soot all over the house and particularly in the room where the piano is (piano located right next to the unit). This happened approximately two years ago.  I am just now looking at it. The owner says that she could wipe her finger in the debris on the plate and it came up black.

However, at this time there seems to be very little residue there. There is no smell. There is dust of course, but what happened to all the soot? Where did it go? No cleaning of any sort has happened in the piano, whereas significant black crud was cleaned off the walls and furniture.

Is it possible that it has been somehow absorbed into the wiid and metal parts? If so, is this an issue that requires complete replacement of these parts? Or can it just be cleaned up like dust?

Does anyone know, or have some insight on this? I need to decide whether to just clean it, or rebuild it.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

She claims that absolutely no cleaning has been done on the piano. Today was the first day she touched it (she claims) in many months. She was mystified as to why it no longer made her fingers black. 

Servicemaster cleaned up the house. I don't know if they are experts in this but they used those "magic" sponges to wipe everything down. She told them not to touch the piano.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-25-2020 20:23
From: Jim Ialeggio
Subject: Soot question (again)

Having had a shop fire with $120k of soot damage (no structural damage), I have noticed in the first years, after the cleanup, that the nasty smell of soot seems to have a half life or something like that. Ozone I think also breaks down chemical bonds in the soot, but time and oxidation (I guess) seems to really do the job for good. So I think its reasonable to guess that the apparently disappearing soot is in fact disappearing very gradually, as chemical bonds are broken or weakened.

Also, re the customer's situation, a gas back draft is different than an actual fire, where bad things like plastic (chlorine) are vaporized. So their soot was probably not that chemically active to start with. In our shop fire, we were able to save all the machines and motors, by acting quick, with a machinery recovery specialist to neutralize the nasty soot. In our case the plastic content was not off the deep end, so though the soot was chemically active, it was not irremediably so...nasty stuff...except on sausages, steak, ribs pork loin...

------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026

Original Message:
Sent: 09-25-2020 19:32
From: Henry Mooney
Subject: Soot question (again)

Peter: Soot is poison. It has the same carincogenic substance as tobacco
smoke and roofing tar.

It is good news that the owner had the house cleaned.

I hope that was done by an expert in dealing with hazardous materials.
Soot is only slightly less dangerous than asbestos.

I would ask the owner if she had the piano cleaned also.

Maybe she did.

If the piano was closed at the time of the event, maybe only a little
soot entered the action.

The only good news I have is that soot is most dangerous when you breathe
it in.

If she had the whole place cleaned thoroughly, it was then that she and
whoever cleaned it for her would have been exposed.

I would look carefully INSIDE the piano. If a little soot is left inside
it is probably safe to use a wet rag or paper towel to remove the stuff.

Soot consists of incredibly tiny particles, so getting it on your skin is
not a good idea either.

Wet cleaning wearing gloves and getting rid of the rags is the way to go.

Whatever you do, do NOT vacuum the piano until you have wet cleaned it.

Hank Mooney
San Francisco


Original Message:
Sent: 9/25/2020 6:26:00 PM
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Soot question (again)

I know this subject has been dealt with here before but this is slightly different.

A propane fired "fireplace"unit backed up and blew soot all over the house and particularly in the room where the piano is (piano located right next to the unit). This happened approximately two years ago.  I am just now looking at it. The owner says that she could wipe her finger in the debris on the plate and it came up black.

However, at this time there seems to be very little residue there. There is no smell. There is dust of course, but what happened to all the soot? Where did it go? No cleaning of any sort has happened in the piano, whereas significant black crud was cleaned off the walls and furniture.

Is it possible that it has been somehow absorbed into the wiid and metal parts? If so, is this an issue that requires complete replacement of these parts? Or can it just be cleaned up like dust?

Does anyone know, or have some insight on this? I need to decide whether to just clean it, or rebuild it.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------