Pianotech

Use of metric wire is one possible explanation. Might this per chance be a Hamburg Steinway?

Are you certain the piano has not been restrung previously?

Also, where you find the wire gauge numbers, are you interpreting them to apply in the  correct direction, left or right, of where they appear?

Best, 

Alan

Use of metric wire is one possible explanation. Might this per chance be a Hamburg Steinway?

Are you certain the piano has not been restrung previously?

Also, where you find the wire gauge numbers, are you interpreting them to apply in the  correct direction, left or right, of where they appear?

Best, 

Alan

Hey Tony, I just checked the steinway book and if it's a Model I with a serial number between 91702 and 216280 then the smallest treble size is 13. Some earlier uprights used 12 and 12.5 but those were 85 note. 

But you're right that there are different measurements depending on what country the wire is from. My recommendation would be to just go off micrometer measurements or rescale the instrument based on whatever wire you're going to use. 

Tony,

What is your impression of how the piano sounded before destringing (assuming it is destrung)?

Possible dumb question #1: Have you checked and possibly rechecked your mic or dial caliper to make sure that where you're reading is in fact accurate? (I have a dial caliper that reads .001" different at the tip vs the inner jaws. I always double check this and compensate accordingly when I use this one. 

Dumb question #2: You've checked the entire section for consistency? I've seen some of these (though marked) with 12.5 on the last two notes. And...You've checked each of the progressive gauge sections and they're all consistently .001" "off"?

Not trying to insult your intelligence. Just trying not to assume anything.

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

Hey Tony, I just checked the steinway book and if it's a Model I with a serial number between 91702 and 216280 then the smallest treble size is 13. Some earlier uprights used 12 and 12.5 but those were 85 note. 

But you're right that there are different measurements depending on what country the wire is from. My recommendation would be to just go off micrometer measurements or rescale the instrument based on whatever wire you're going to use. 

Hey Tony, I just checked the steinway book and if it's a Model I with a serial number between 91702 and 216280 then the smallest treble size is 13. Some earlier uprights used 12 and 12.5 but those were 85 note. 

But you're right that there are different measurements depending on what country the wire is from. My recommendation would be to just go off micrometer measurements or rescale the instrument based on whatever wire you're going to use. 

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the info! The serial is #73006, so maybe I'm incorrect thinking it's an I? I think I'll follow your suggestion and just go off the micrometer measurements. 

Hey Tony, I just checked the steinway book and if it's a Model I with a serial number between 91702 and 216280 then the smallest treble size is 13. Some earlier uprights used 12 and 12.5 but those were 85 note. 

But you're right that there are different measurements depending on what country the wire is from. My recommendation would be to just go off micrometer measurements or rescale the instrument based on whatever wire you're going to use. 

Well okay...1892. Anything goes 😉 

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the info! The serial is #73006, so maybe I'm incorrect thinking it's an I? I think I'll follow your suggestion and just go off the micrometer measurements. 

Hey Tony, I just checked the steinway book and if it's a Model I with a serial number between 91702 and 216280 then the smallest treble size is 13. Some earlier uprights used 12 and 12.5 but those were 85 note. 

But you're right that there are different measurements depending on what country the wire is from. My recommendation would be to just go off micrometer measurements or rescale the instrument based on whatever wire you're going to use. 

Ha! That's kind of the conclusion I'm coming to 😜

Well okay...1892. Anything goes 😉 

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the info! The serial is #73006, so maybe I'm incorrect thinking it's an I? I think I'll follow your suggestion and just go off the micrometer measurements. 

Hey Tony, I just checked the steinway book and if it's a Model I with a serial number between 91702 and 216280 then the smallest treble size is 13. Some earlier uprights used 12 and 12.5 but those were 85 note. 

But you're right that there are different measurements depending on what country the wire is from. My recommendation would be to just go off micrometer measurements or rescale the instrument based on whatever wire you're going to use. 

Tony, if you contact Steinway, they should be able to verify the model per the serial number. And perhaps tell you what their version of the string scale should be.

Ha! That's kind of the conclusion I'm coming to 😜

Well okay...1892. Anything goes 😉 

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the info! The serial is #73006, so maybe I'm incorrect thinking it's an I? I think I'll follow your suggestion and just go off the micrometer measurements. 

Tony, if you contact Steinway, they should be able to verify the model per the serial number. And perhaps tell you what their version of the string scale should be.

Ha! That's kind of the conclusion I'm coming to 😜

Well okay...1892. Anything goes 😉 

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the info! The serial is #73006, so maybe I'm incorrect thinking it's an I? I think I'll follow your suggestion and just go off the micrometer measurements. 

David,

I would have thought that strings would stretch over their life span and therefore yes, they might thin eventually.

I tested this several years ago with a #15 wire, hung from a rafter with 160 lbs of weight tensioning it and two upright damper block screw clamps to measure against.

There was some initial stretch, though some of it may have been settling or straightening.  But after two years the distance between my markers (about 113 CM) had not changed more than .2 mm and most of the changes could be attibuted to temperature.

This was completely opposite of what I expected and suggests that most or all pitch drop is from changes in the frame, plate, soundboard or string bends.

Tony, if you contact Steinway, they should be able to verify the model per the serial number. And perhaps tell you what their version of the string scale should be.

Ha! That's kind of the conclusion I'm coming to 😜

Well okay...1892. Anything goes 😉 

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the info! The serial is #73006, so maybe I'm incorrect thinking it's an I? I think I'll follow your suggestion and just go off the micrometer measurements. 

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the info! The serial is #73006, so maybe I'm incorrect thinking it's an I? I think I'll follow your suggestion and just go off the micrometer measurements. 

Hey Tony, I just checked the steinway book and if it's a Model I with a serial number between 91702 and 216280 then the smallest treble size is 13. Some earlier uprights used 12 and 12.5 but those were 85 note. 

But you're right that there are different measurements depending on what country the wire is from. My recommendation would be to just go off micrometer measurements or rescale the instrument based on whatever wire you're going to use. 

Hi Tony,

Always feel free to reach out to Steinway & Sons for information.

According to our factory log books, #73006 is a model F which left the factory in February of 1892.

According to The Official Guide to Steinway Pianos, the model F was built on an N scale in 1892.

According to the technical reference guide, the steel wire sizes for a model N are as follows

13 - 6

13.5 - 4

14 - 4

14.5 - 4

15 - 4

15.5 - 4

16 - 9

16.5 - 8

17 - 8

18 - 11

Hi Morgan,

Thanks for the info! The serial is #73006, so maybe I'm incorrect thinking it's an I? I think I'll follow your suggestion and just go off the micrometer measurements. 

Hey Tony, I just checked the steinway book and if it's a Model I with a serial number between 91702 and 216280 then the smallest treble size is 13. Some earlier uprights used 12 and 12.5 but those were 85 note. 

But you're right that there are different measurements depending on what country the wire is from. My recommendation would be to just go off micrometer measurements or rescale the instrument based on whatever wire you're going to use. 

I have had a similar experience when measuring strings, and center pins too for that matter. One thing I would try would be to try measuring new wire of a known gauge and see what reading you get. My experience with the digital caliper I use is that I consistently get readings that are about a thousandth less than nominal size. Perhaps it is an error with my caliper. Not sure. What I do know is that I can get extremely consistent readings, so when working with strings or center pins I use it as much to compare  the existing to the replacement to confirm I am getting an exact match. Obviously if you're measuring for bass string replacement you want to be sure your measuring device is actually giving correct readings not just correct comparison. 

Not sure if that's helpful, but it's my two cents worth of experience. 

The takeaway here (and from other posts) is that, in addition to the accuracy of a given measuring tool, all measuring devices must be calibrated before each measuring session. Without that, they are only producing readings relative to their mis-calibration at any given time.

Best,

Alan 

Tony,

Just as a theoretical point; If you strung one unison with 12.5 and another with 13 would you be able to tell the difference in tone (though the difference in tone between one note and the next might be greater than the difference between string sizes).

I do understand that an increase of 1/2 or 1 string size across the whole piano might created dangerous overall tension issues, but then can most modern pianos tolerate this amount of increaed tension?