Pianotech

This occurred a few weeks ago. I was called by one of my church clients, which has a Yamaha C5 #5956482 (2001) to resolve an issue with a keystick making a noise (for brevity I won't go into the details). It required removing and replacing the action stack. The repair went smoothly, and problem was solved. Got a call the next day from the church pianist that most of the keys in the upper half of the scale wouldn't play. ​I met her at the piano a couple days later, and she said that most of the kays were now playable except for a handful in the treble. The problem keys were where the hammers were being caught by the backchecks before they could complete their strokes. I was strongly suspicious that the action stack had somehow shifted to the rear by some sliver of an inch. After looking closely at the bracket notches made in the keyframe for each of the end brackets, I saw that the notches were deliberately made about an 1/8" longer than the brackets, and that shims had been inserted at the front of the notches, filling a space between the end of the notches and the front of the bracket "toes." Acting on a hunch, I loosened all the action bracket screws some, took a screwdriver, and with the palm of my hand, thumped it against the "heel" of each bracket, and tightened the screws--problem solved! Had the pianist come and apply some rapid-fire repetition on the former problem keys, and they all passed with flying colors! Called Yamaha support a few days later, and the tech pulled a grand action as we spoke and he noted that it had the shims in the bracket notches. He made a comment that Yamaha grand keyframes are more flexible than other brands. I suggested that the shims were put in after the stack was set in place (but before the stack was screwed down), and the brackets applied a forward pressure to the shims, which was released when I removed the bracket screws & it shifted. Thought I'd put this out there for anyone who has experienced the same thing, or who may see it happen in the future.

P.S. Yes, I did remove and replace the bracket screws in the correct order for Yamaha grand action brackets!

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------

Drill holes for bridge pins to index the bracket feet. I do it all the time. Not just front-to-back but side-to-side too.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 20:10
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

This occurred a few weeks ago. I was called by one of my church clients, which has a Yamaha C5 #5956482 (2001) to resolve an issue with a keystick making a noise (for brevity I won't go into the details). It required removing and replacing the action stack. The repair went smoothly, and problem was solved. Got a call the next day from the church pianist that most of the keys in the upper half of the scale wouldn't play. ​I met her at the piano a couple days later, and she said that most of the kays were now playable except for a handful in the treble. The problem keys were where the hammers were being caught by the backchecks before they could complete their strokes. I was strongly suspicious that the action stack had somehow shifted to the rear by some sliver of an inch. After looking closely at the bracket notches made in the keyframe for each of the end brackets, I saw that the notches were deliberately made about an 1/8" longer than the brackets, and that shims had been inserted at the front of the notches, filling a space between the end of the notches and the front of the bracket "toes." Acting on a hunch, I loosened all the action bracket screws some, took a screwdriver, and with the palm of my hand, thumped it against the "heel" of each bracket, and tightened the screws--problem solved! Had the pianist come and apply some rapid-fire repetition on the former problem keys, and they all passed with flying colors! Called Yamaha support a few days later, and the tech pulled a grand action as we spoke and he noted that it had the shims in the bracket notches. He made a comment that Yamaha grand keyframes are more flexible than other brands. I suggested that the shims were put in after the stack was set in place (but before the stack was screwed down), and the brackets applied a forward pressure to the shims, which was released when I removed the bracket screws & it shifted. Thought I'd put this out there for anyone who has experienced the same thing, or who may see it happen in the future.

P.S. Yes, I did remove and replace the bracket screws in the correct order for Yamaha grand action brackets!

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------

Huh? What do bridge pins have to do with action brackets? Are you referring to something done in rebuilding?

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 22:44
From: Jon Page
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

Drill holes for bridge pins to index the bracket feet. I do it all the time. Not just front-to-back but side-to-side too.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 20:10
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

This occurred a few weeks ago. I was called by one of my church clients, which has a Yamaha C5 #5956482 (2001) to resolve an issue with a keystick making a noise (for brevity I won't go into the details). It required removing and replacing the action stack. The repair went smoothly, and problem was solved. Got a call the next day from the church pianist that most of the keys in the upper half of the scale wouldn't play. ​I met her at the piano a couple days later, and she said that most of the kays were now playable except for a handful in the treble. The problem keys were where the hammers were being caught by the backchecks before they could complete their strokes. I was strongly suspicious that the action stack had somehow shifted to the rear by some sliver of an inch. After looking closely at the bracket notches made in the keyframe for each of the end brackets, I saw that the notches were deliberately made about an 1/8" longer than the brackets, and that shims had been inserted at the front of the notches, filling a space between the end of the notches and the front of the bracket "toes." Acting on a hunch, I loosened all the action bracket screws some, took a screwdriver, and with the palm of my hand, thumped it against the "heel" of each bracket, and tightened the screws--problem solved! Had the pianist come and apply some rapid-fire repetition on the former problem keys, and they all passed with flying colors! Called Yamaha support a few days later, and the tech pulled a grand action as we spoke and he noted that it had the shims in the bracket notches. He made a comment that Yamaha grand keyframes are more flexible than other brands. I suggested that the shims were put in after the stack was set in place (but before the stack was screwed down), and the brackets applied a forward pressure to the shims, which was released when I removed the bracket screws & it shifted. Thought I'd put this out there for anyone who has experienced the same thing, or who may see it happen in the future.

P.S. Yes, I did remove and replace the bracket screws in the correct order for Yamaha grand action brackets!

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11/13/2022 10:49:00 PM
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: RE: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

Huh? What do bridge pins have to do with action brackets? Are you referring to something done in rebuilding?

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 22:44
From: Jon Page
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

Drill holes for bridge pins to index the bracket feet. I do it all the time. Not just front-to-back but side-to-side too.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 20:10
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

This occurred a few weeks ago. I was called by one of my church clients, which has a Yamaha C5 #5956482 (2001) to resolve an issue with a keystick making a noise (for brevity I won't go into the details). It required removing and replacing the action stack. The repair went smoothly, and problem was solved. Got a call the next day from the church pianist that most of the keys in the upper half of the scale wouldn't play. ​I met her at the piano a couple days later, and she said that most of the kays were now playable except for a handful in the treble. The problem keys were where the hammers were being caught by the backchecks before they could complete their strokes. I was strongly suspicious that the action stack had somehow shifted to the rear by some sliver of an inch. After looking closely at the bracket notches made in the keyframe for each of the end brackets, I saw that the notches were deliberately made about an 1/8" longer than the brackets, and that shims had been inserted at the front of the notches, filling a space between the end of the notches and the front of the bracket "toes." Acting on a hunch, I loosened all the action bracket screws some, took a screwdriver, and with the palm of my hand, thumped it against the "heel" of each bracket, and tightened the screws--problem solved! Had the pianist come and apply some rapid-fire repetition on the former problem keys, and they all passed with flying colors! Called Yamaha support a few days later, and the tech pulled a grand action as we spoke and he noted that it had the shims in the bracket notches. He made a comment that Yamaha grand keyframes are more flexible than other brands. I suggested that the shims were put in after the stack was set in place (but before the stack was screwed down), and the brackets applied a forward pressure to the shims, which was released when I removed the bracket screws & it shifted. Thought I'd put this out there for anyone who has experienced the same thing, or who may see it happen in the future.

P.S. Yes, I did remove and replace the bracket screws in the correct order for Yamaha grand action brackets!

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------

Ok. He would have to understand that the issue was because of the shim, not the position of the brackets. The idea of the shim is apparently to provide a well-seated stability. I suspect Yamaha did not intend for there to be a fraction of a millimeter give when the screws were loosened that would have to be reversed before the screws were fastened down. I could potentially see where a bridge pin behind the bracket heel could possibly prevent backward shift…but gosh, that shift was probably 1/64", or 1/128". If the bridge pin was installed and put forward pressure on the brackets, would we see things get messed up again in a different way? There is a law of unintended consequences…

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-14-2022 00:55
From: David Love
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

I think he means for indexing the location of the stack on the key frame. 

Get Outlook for iOS

Original Message:
Sent: 11/13/2022 10:49:00 PM
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: RE: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

Huh? What do bridge pins have to do with action brackets? Are you referring to something done in rebuilding?

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 22:44
From: Jon Page
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

Drill holes for bridge pins to index the bracket feet. I do it all the time. Not just front-to-back but side-to-side too.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 20:10
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

This occurred a few weeks ago. I was called by one of my church clients, which has a Yamaha C5 #5956482 (2001) to resolve an issue with a keystick making a noise (for brevity I won't go into the details). It required removing and replacing the action stack. The repair went smoothly, and problem was solved. Got a call the next day from the church pianist that most of the keys in the upper half of the scale wouldn't play. ​I met her at the piano a couple days later, and she said that most of the kays were now playable except for a handful in the treble. The problem keys were where the hammers were being caught by the backchecks before they could complete their strokes. I was strongly suspicious that the action stack had somehow shifted to the rear by some sliver of an inch. After looking closely at the bracket notches made in the keyframe for each of the end brackets, I saw that the notches were deliberately made about an 1/8" longer than the brackets, and that shims had been inserted at the front of the notches, filling a space between the end of the notches and the front of the bracket "toes." Acting on a hunch, I loosened all the action bracket screws some, took a screwdriver, and with the palm of my hand, thumped it against the "heel" of each bracket, and tightened the screws--problem solved! Had the pianist come and apply some rapid-fire repetition on the former problem keys, and they all passed with flying colors! Called Yamaha support a few days later, and the tech pulled a grand action as we spoke and he noted that it had the shims in the bracket notches. He made a comment that Yamaha grand keyframes are more flexible than other brands. I suggested that the shims were put in after the stack was set in place (but before the stack was screwed down), and the brackets applied a forward pressure to the shims, which was released when I removed the bracket screws & it shifted. Thought I'd put this out there for anyone who has experienced the same thing, or who may see it happen in the future.

P.S. Yes, I did remove and replace the bracket screws in the correct order for Yamaha grand action brackets!

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------

Somewhere I have a tip that the action bracket screws on a Yamaha grand need to be put on in a certain order and pattern.  Basically you start at the right bracket hole closest to the keys in the high treble. Second screw goes in the bracket at the bass end. 3rd screw in the same bracket on the string side. 4th on the right bracket hole on the string side then go counter clockwise until complete. it is important to use the same screws that came out of the brackets. here is a crude diagram



                                               
                         x 3            x 6         x 5        x4

                         x2             x7           x8         x1

                                                           < --------


------------------------------
James Kelly
Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
Pawleys Island SC
(843) 325-4357
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-14-2022 22:40
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

Ok. He would have to understand that the issue was because of the shim, not the position of the brackets. The idea of the shim is apparently to provide a well-seated stability. I suspect Yamaha did not intend for there to be a fraction of a millimeter give when the screws were loosened that would have to be reversed before the screws were fastened down. I could potentially see where a bridge pin behind the bracket heel could possibly prevent backward shift…but gosh, that shift was probably 1/64", or 1/128". If the bridge pin was installed and put forward pressure on the brackets, would we see things get messed up again in a different way? There is a law of unintended consequences…

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888

Original Message:
Sent: 11-14-2022 00:55
From: David Love
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

I think he means for indexing the location of the stack on the key frame. 

Get Outlook for iOS

Original Message:
Sent: 11/13/2022 10:49:00 PM
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: RE: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

Huh? What do bridge pins have to do with action brackets? Are you referring to something done in rebuilding?

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 22:44
From: Jon Page
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

Drill holes for bridge pins to index the bracket feet. I do it all the time. Not just front-to-back but side-to-side too.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 11-13-2022 20:10
From: Robert Sluss
Subject: Yamaha action stack shifting after removal

This occurred a few weeks ago. I was called by one of my church clients, which has a Yamaha C5 #5956482 (2001) to resolve an issue with a keystick making a noise (for brevity I won't go into the details). It required removing and replacing the action stack. The repair went smoothly, and problem was solved. Got a call the next day from the church pianist that most of the keys in the upper half of the scale wouldn't play. ​I met her at the piano a couple days later, and she said that most of the kays were now playable except for a handful in the treble. The problem keys were where the hammers were being caught by the backchecks before they could complete their strokes. I was strongly suspicious that the action stack had somehow shifted to the rear by some sliver of an inch. After looking closely at the bracket notches made in the keyframe for each of the end brackets, I saw that the notches were deliberately made about an 1/8" longer than the brackets, and that shims had been inserted at the front of the notches, filling a space between the end of the notches and the front of the bracket "toes." Acting on a hunch, I loosened all the action bracket screws some, took a screwdriver, and with the palm of my hand, thumped it against the "heel" of each bracket, and tightened the screws--problem solved! Had the pianist come and apply some rapid-fire repetition on the former problem keys, and they all passed with flying colors! Called Yamaha support a few days later, and the tech pulled a grand action as we spoke and he noted that it had the shims in the bracket notches. He made a comment that Yamaha grand keyframes are more flexible than other brands. I suggested that the shims were put in after the stack was set in place (but before the stack was screwed down), and the brackets applied a forward pressure to the shims, which was released when I removed the bracket screws & it shifted. Thought I'd put this out there for anyone who has experienced the same thing, or who may see it happen in the future.

P.S. Yes, I did remove and replace the bracket screws in the correct order for Yamaha grand action brackets!

------------------------------
Robert Sluss
Lake City FL
(386) 752-1888
------------------------------