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Steinway Leg size differences

  • 1.  Steinway Leg size differences

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 01-20-2023 17:11
    We have 2 D's on a stage, one is on a dolly truck, the other is not.  But I'd like to swap the legs. 
    Our "Performance" D is on the truck and I'd rather have it with casters.  And our "Ensemble" D has the Hamburg short legs with large double brass casters.  Both these pianos are NY D's.  #348xxx and #388xxx 
    Both sets of legs have the slide/lock plates.  But one is the Wedge type, and other is the Toggle type.  
    Do you see any reason why I couldn't just swap the legs?


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    Dave Foster, RPT
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  • 2.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 01-20-2023 19:30

    Dave,

    I don't see why it can't be done. Be prepared to change the leg plate pairing with each corresponding leg. Also, be prepared to adjust the recess depth of the leg plates on the piano.



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    Roger Gable RPT
    Gable Piano
    Everett WA
    (425) 252-5000
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  • 3.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 01-20-2023 21:13
    Dave,

    Yes it probably CAN be done but I'm not so sure it SHOULD be done. What will you do if an error is made in the process, or that it is decided that you want to go back and it gets COMPLICATED?

    I'm not trying to be Johnny Raincloud here, but I an seeing some real negatives potentially. 

    Peter Grey Piano Doctor

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    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    (603) 686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
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  • 4.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Member
    Posted 01-20-2023 23:15
    FUHGETABOUTIT.... Put them both on spider trucks Moving a piano this size around on a stage just because it has casters is not a great idea. Take the double casters off and sell them to buy the spider dolly. You will probably rue the day if you try what you are proposing because of the mortises the plates need to fit in.

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    James Kelly
    Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
    Pawleys Island SC
    (843) 325-4357
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  • 5.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Posted 01-21-2023 08:01
    I installed concert casters on a Bösendorfer 200 in our university recital hall a couple of years back.  At first I was going to mess with leg length, but decided instead to shim the pedal lyre.  I think the shim I used was about an inch thick, and I had to source stock for new pedal rods and lyre supports.  We use an adjustable bench, and thus far I have had nobody comment about keyboard height.

    Prior to that I had jacked up a Baldwin L in our practice rooms to accommodate a tall student.  I had placed 2x4 blocks under the casters, and shimmed the lyre by the same 1 1/2 inch dimension.  The student was very pleased, and other students had no complaints about that particular instrument.  Again, an adjustable bench was in play.  Upon the graduation of that student, I returned the Baldwin to its original configuration.

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    Floyd Gadd RPT
    Regina SK
    (306) 502-9103Floyd Gadd RPT
    Regina SK
    (306) 502-9103
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  • 6.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 01-21-2023 11:36

    James,

    You're incorrect. Placing a piano with the large casters, on a "spider dolly" is impossible.  Large-scale casters require a shorter leg. That shorter leg placed on a "spider dolly" will make the keybed too low to the floor and the lyre will hit the floor. I've encountered this before.

    Roger



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    Roger Gable RPT
    Gable Piano
    Everett WA
    (425) 252-5000
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  • 7.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 01-22-2023 08:24
    I believe Jansen sells a spider dolly for pianos with the huge casters.  I have a new Yamaha CFX under my care that came with the huge casters.  The casters were removed and the Jansen spider dolly worked perfectly.  Don't ask as to why the casters were removed.

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    Tim Coates RPT
    Sioux Falls SD
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  • 8.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 01-22-2023 15:28
    Tim,
    Well, we all learn something everyday on this Pianotech site. I looked in the Jansen catalog an indeed found a special dolly for those pianos with large casters. 
    As to your question, why did they remove the casters? Its possible from past experience that some stage managers don't want the hard brass rolling on the stage floor -- some stages are made with a hard rubber coating that brass could damage. I came across the situation years ago when the local concert hall wanted to rent my Steinway "D" but would not accept a piano if it have the brass casters. I purchased a set of large replacement casters that had a soft plastic coating over the brass. That met their specifications.

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    Roger Gable RPT
    Gable Piano
    Everett WA
    (425) 252-5000
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  • 9.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 01-23-2023 11:29
    Yes, there is a short and long bend arm to go into the tube of the grand truck and there are two different sized square pads to support the leg.  

    There are different lengths of legs and lyres depending on the casters.  Check with Jansen bench people.

    The trouble with this is the bottom of the lyre will probably have less clearance to the floor like you have been told.  Changing the legs can be a solution.  If you are crossing a floor with obstacles be warned you'll probably need to replace thy lyre also.

    There have been studies done on the sound and the big caster on the floor will produce a better sound as you lose transfer of sound through he grand truck and its softer wheels with the floor.

    Jessica Masse
    --
    Sent from Gmail Mobile





  • 10.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Member
    Posted 01-22-2023 11:22
    Okay I stand corrected about the height /dolly issue but Tim's lead on a spider dolly is worth investigation . Anytime people see wheels on a piano they assume they can move it around. I am sure Tim has a great back story

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    James Kelly
    Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
    Pawleys Island SC
    (843) 325-4357
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  • 11.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 01-23-2023 13:27
    I really don't know a lot about the decision.  I was asked to prep a new DCFX in a university recital hall and the piano was already on a spider dolly.  I asked the dealer where the dolly came from:  Jansen.  I understand the studies about large casters versus spider dollies.  But the short answer is  I don't know why it is on a dolly.

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    Tim Coates RPT
    Sioux Falls SD
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  • 12.  RE: Steinway Leg size differences

    Posted 01-23-2023 14:01
    Two approaches of accommodating a traditional spider dolly to this situation exist in our university collection:

    1.  Fabricate and paint a set of three wooden spacers that will provide the additional dolly height needed.  Insert these spacers between the dolly arms and the leg receptacles.  A longer bolt will be needed to make the connection between the leg receptacle and the dolly arm.

    2. Fabricate and paint a set of three wooden spacers that will provide the additional dolly height needed.  Size the spacers such that they will just fit inside the leg receptacles on the dolly.  Insert/glue  dowels into the tops of these spacers that are large enough to fit just inside the caster socket cavities in the piano legs.  The leg receptacles secure the blocks in place on the dolly arms, and the dowels secure the legs in place on the tops of the blocks.

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    Floyd Gadd RPT
    Regina SK
    (306) 502-9103
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