The only solution that ever consistently and permanently cured verdigris for me is to rebush and repin the hammer centers. It works, but to be complete, it would be necessary to repin all the action centers, in which case I'm not sure it's more economical than new parts. I use Renner graphited and pre-glued bushing cloth with the reamer tool that they sell. I don't follow their procedure for activating the glue, but rather use the traditional procedure with wood glue as if there were no dry glue already in the cloth.
Paul Larudee, RPT
Original Message:
Sent: 4/18/2024 10:10:00 AM
From: Tremaine Parsons
Subject: RE: Vertigris?
Tim,
You can also take side cutters to a grinding wheel and grind the side down flush to the cutting blades. This is fine for center pins. I've been using mine for years
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Tremaine Parsons RPT
Georgetown CA
(530) 333-9299
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Original Message:
Sent: 04-18-2024 04:19
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Vertigris?
Tim,
The approach I would take with the owner is to gather several printed "discussions" on this matter (perhaps an earlier one right from this platform) and hand it all to him and say: "Before I agree to tackle this, you need to read all of this so you know what's involved and why".
The reason for the above is that it's not really a matter of money (per se) but rather a matter of trust. They need to be fully convinced of the validity of the situation, that you're not making any of it up, and that there is the possibility that it could be worse than it appears right now. It carries greater authority when coming from the "mouths" of others rather than you (no matter how much he likes and trusts you). He needs to understand that it is a very widespread problem resulting from some manufacturing process and has nothing to do with anything he did or you did. It just IS...and it's a PAIN IN THE NECK (literally) to fix. Then he needs to commit to paying you for whatever time and materials are required for the job (it's only fair).
Personally, I would use SS pre-cut center pins as a replacement. They are EXPENSIVE (customer pays for this) but they will eliminate two steps of the procedure (cutting the ends), eliminate any distortion of the ends from the cutting, and if there is any contamination of any sort in there they will not expose an alloy to it, basically sealing up any chemical reaction from occurring later.
I agree that testing the chemical treatment contained in the "fantastik" is an option to suggest, however the time tested reliable method has proven to be the more labor intensive re-pinning procedure. (Offer to do one right in front of him so he understands what's involved, then multiply by 88 or possibly 264).
The point here is simply that this is not your fault, nor his fault, and there is no reliable "shortcut" to remedy this and you need to be paid whatever it takes to fix it. Otherwise he'll need to live with it or replace the piano with a better one.
EDIT: Is there any possibility that this ALSO has growing bracket problems?
Peter Grey Piano Doctor
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Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
Original Message:
Sent: 04-18-2024 03:19
From: Douglas Mahard
Subject: Vertigris?
Tim,
In the vertigris study the CT PTG chapter did and published in the Journal, the study found that the household cleaner Fantastik definitely freed up the friction caused by vertigris. As someone pointed out, this is not a vertigris problem and I agree. However, I have privately tested Fantastik on similar situations as the one you have encountered and the soaking of the bushing cloth with Fantastik worked beautifully. One needs to allow the Fantastik 12 to 24 hours to wick off before everything is operating smoothly.
Try it on one flange if you're hesitant. A drop or two from a hypo oiler is all that is needed.
Doug Mahard
Original Message:
Sent: 4/17/2024 10:35:00 AM
From: Timothy Edwards
Subject: Vertigris?
1983? Wurlitzer B. Grand #1720371----- Been "CLP-ing" hammer flanges each year for the past 10 years because customer didn't want to pay for re-pinning. He's now ready to "bite the bullet" so-to-speak after too much frustration. He is, however dithering over whether to repin the entire piano or only those problem keys (quite a few). I can't remember who built this piano, or whether it is one known to have vertigris issues or not. Can anyone enlighten me?
Also -- Having never re-pinned an entire set of hammer flanges, any suggestions for speeding the process to make it a bit more economical for him? (I've re-pinned a few here and there as needed before, but never the entire set.)
Lastly-- how long should I allow for 88 hammer flanges?
TIA--
Tim
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Timothy Edwards
Beckley WV
(740) 517-7636
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