Pianotech

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

there was a story about this possibly in the ptg journal. a grand piano was rebuilt so all of the notes on i played the same pitch. i think it was for a phone or insurance commercial. two grands where in the commercial positioned with the keyboards facing each other and a pianist in the middle on a bench. first the regular grand is played and then the modified piano . the point was not all phone plans or insurance is the same

------------------------------
James Kelly
Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
Pawleys Island SC
843-325-4357
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

You are missing my point: if strings sound at their best near 70% of their breaking point which key would sound better and which key would break (in theory and practice)?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Blaine,
I thought pianos (non-high tension scales) were scaled at a low of 50% and a high of  60% breaking point. Anyone out there who does scaling set me straight?
Roger

------------------------------
Roger Gable
Gable Piano
Everett WA
425-252-5000
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 11:14
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

You are missing my point: if strings sound at their best near 70% of their breaking point which key would sound better and which key would break (in theory and practice)?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Mostly I scale at low 40's, to about 60% bp.

If I take an L scale I am working on now, from note 52-27 at the end of the long bridge, all notes tuned to 523, without changing any lengths, by note 44 I'm at 100%, increasing to over 500% by note 27. Changing wire sizes does not help extend lower than 44.  The whole tension thing is defined by length, which is why the lengths defined by the design of the piano determine a lot in how far you can mess with a challenged scale. One can change bridges and the shape of the bridge, but the exponential curve of the lengths, while having some flexibility, is really not all that flexible, relative to frequency.   ​​​

------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 17:37
From: Roger Gable
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

Blaine,
I thought pianos (non-high tension scales) were scaled at a low of 50% and a high of  60% breaking point. Anyone out there who does scaling set me straight?
Roger

------------------------------
Roger Gable
Gable Piano
Everett WA
425-252-5000

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 11:14
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

You are missing my point: if strings sound at their best near 70% of their breaking point which key would sound better and which key would break (in theory and practice)?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Note 44.  That was half the answer.

This was supposed to be an academic exercise, or perhaps a manufacturer's experiment to determine ideal string lengths.

I once found an upright that had been mistakenly tuned a minor third sharp.  The sound was thin and "strained" but nothing broke.

It is still a good idea for a technician's course; to hear the effect of different string lengths and tensions, like moving hammers around on a piano to hear and feel the effect of different hammer weights and sizes without making a new set.

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 20:30
From: Jim Ialeggio
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

Mostly I scale at low 40's, to about 60% bp.

If I take an L scale I am working on now, from note 52-27 at the end of the long bridge, all notes tuned to 523, without changing any lengths, by note 44 I'm at 100%, increasing to over 500% by note 27. Changing wire sizes does not help extend lower than 44.  The whole tension thing is defined by length, which is why the lengths defined by the design of the piano determine a lot in how far you can mess with a challenged scale. One can change bridges and the shape of the bridge, but the exponential curve of the lengths, while having some flexibility, is really not all that flexible, relative to frequency.   ​​​

------------------------------
Jim Ialeggio
grandpianosolutions.com
Shirley, MA
978 425-9026

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 17:37
From: Roger Gable
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

Blaine,
I thought pianos (non-high tension scales) were scaled at a low of 50% and a high of  60% breaking point. Anyone out there who does scaling set me straight?
Roger

------------------------------
Roger Gable
Gable Piano
Everett WA
425-252-5000

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 11:14
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

You are missing my point: if strings sound at their best near 70% of their breaking point which key would sound better and which key would break (in theory and practice)?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 1/18/2021 11:14:00 AM
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: RE: Has anyone tried this?

You are missing my point: if strings sound at their best near 70% of their breaking point which key would sound better and which key would break (in theory and practice)?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

https://youtu.be/N6wHFOcYKVc

I understand what you're asking & this video has nothing to do with that, but someone mentioned it & I felt like sharing. I don't know if anyone has done what you are suggesting. 

------------------------------
Maggie Jusiel, RPT
Athens, WV
(304)952-8615
mags@timandmaggie.net
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 1/18/2021 11:54:00 AM
From: Margaret Jusiel
Subject: RE: Has anyone tried this?

https://youtu.be/N6wHFOcYKVc

I understand what you're asking & this video has nothing to do with that, but someone mentioned it & I felt like sharing. I don't know if anyone has done what you are suggesting. 

------------------------------
Maggie Jusiel, RPT
Athens, WV
(304)952-8615
mags@timandmaggie.net
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Blaine, my experience is that tuning past about a minor 3rd up bass strings will start to pop, wires perhaps a little more.

------------------------------
Steven Rosenthal
Honolulu HI
808-521-7129
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 12:03
From: Kent Swafford
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

Here is a little about how the monotune piano was made:

https://youtu.be/OsbPCws2Gz4

Sent from my iPad

Original Message:
Sent: 1/18/2021 11:54:00 AM
From: Margaret Jusiel
Subject: RE: Has anyone tried this?

https://youtu.be/N6wHFOcYKVc

I understand what you're asking & this video has nothing to do with that, but someone mentioned it & I felt like sharing. I don't know if anyone has done what you are suggesting.

------------------------------
Maggie Jusiel, RPT
Athens, WV
(304)952-8615
mags@timandmaggie.net

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Yes, a fun experiment (actually just a humoristic demonstration).

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 11:54
From: Margaret Jusiel
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

https://youtu.be/N6wHFOcYKVc

I understand what you're asking & this video has nothing to do with that, but someone mentioned it & I felt like sharing. I don't know if anyone has done what you are suggesting.

------------------------------
Maggie Jusiel, RPT
Athens, WV
(304)952-8615
mags@timandmaggie.net

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 08:24
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

No you can't do It, however there is a video somewhere in which a piano was modified so as to tune all 88 notes to C.

Pwg

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
603-686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

Many years ago I acquired a 1900 Everett grand - strings and everything were original (and some day I WILL get to it!!!). My son asked me how sharp can you pull a string before it breaks. I said, "I don't know exactly, but we can do an experiment." So we turned on the little Accutuner and started adding tension to a bunch of strings in the tenor and low treble. Most broke when they were right about 300 cents sharp.

------------------------------
Terry Farrell
Farrell Piano Service, Inc.
Brandon, Florida
terry@farrellpiano.com
813-684-3505
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------

A student at CalArts wanted to break a string by taking it too sharp as part of a performance. We used a note in the middle of the tenor section of a Baldwin F (7'). It broke at about the same 300 cents sharp as Terry reported. Of course, this will vary from note to note and piano to piano, depending on % of braking point to begin with, sting condition and other factors. I would not recommend trying this on the bass strings of a Bosendorfer, which would break much sooner (and don't bother trying to splice it!).

Alan

------------------------------
Alan Eder, RPT
Herb Alpert School of Music
California Institute of the Arts
Valencia, CA
661.904.6483
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-19-2021 07:57
From: Terrence Farrell
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

Many years ago I acquired a 1900 Everett grand - strings and everything were original (and some day I WILL get to it!!!). My son asked me how sharp can you pull a string before it breaks. I said, "I don't know exactly, but we can do an experiment." So we turned on the little Accutuner and started adding tension to a bunch of strings in the tenor and low treble. Most broke when they were right about 300 cents sharp.

------------------------------
Terry Farrell
Farrell Piano Service, Inc.
Brandon, Florida
terry@farrellpiano.com
813-684-3505

Original Message:
Sent: 01-18-2021 02:22
From: Blaine Hebert
Subject: Has anyone tried this?

This might be a standard exercise in piano courses (or not):

What would happen if someone took an old but functional upright and tuned every note from C 52 (at 523.3) up to the same pitch (for example C 523.3) down into the tenor or bass?

What would the strings sound like?

At what note would a string break?

------------------------------
Blaine Hebert
Duarte CA
626-795-5170
------------------------------