Alexander,
Thank you for the the suggestion. I took 4 samples across the keyboard and got basically 5.6 AR. I took the AR with old set and new. With already a 10mm dip I assumed it was as good as I could get it without increasing Dip. Maybe I am wrong. Open to suggestions. Always learning. I may double check by another method of measurement though.
David S.
Thank you for those photos and the idea. I taped a bunch of leads on for this one and you were right. It felt acceptable. But after leading it still feels a little resistant at pianissimo. That could be me. I like a piano to have an easy and very quiet pianissimo. This will be in a large church so they may not play that quiet. Other than that the action plays and feels very nice.
I regret thinning the top 10 hammers from 11mm to 10mm. Even though they seemed heavy they had better tone before. But the belly is really forgiving on this one so I think i'll be ok.
Chuck,
I tried the rep sting tension as you suggested. I feel what you are talking about. On this piano it will make a subtle difference. The key height is good.
Thank you David love for the thread on Stanwood chart deviation. I have talked with other rebuilders that don't follow it either. There pianos are wonderful and exciting to play. It seems, like many things, there are things to take away and other to ignore.
When all is said and done I like the feel of the 5-6 octaves now even though they are a little high on FW but the 3rd octave is slightly uncomfortable at pianissimo which I didn't expect.
My BW is about 40. DW A0 53g, C4 49g, E5-C88 48g. DW is about 20g spread, average of 12g friction.
Thanks for all the help!!
Daniel
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Daniel Achten
Chattanooga TN
423-760-2458
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Original Message:
Sent: 07-21-2021 16:49
From: Alexander Brusilovsky
Subject: S&S New Hammer SW high. Help.
There is great possibility you didn't duplicate exactly AR , which might cause DW and BW increase. Could you measure old and new one? Would be reasonable to analyze it before capstan job as you might correct it by capstan reposition.
Alexander Brusilovsky
Original Message:
Sent: 7/20/2021 10:42:00 AM
From: Charles Cook
Subject: RE: S&S New Hammer SW high. Help.
Another thought, Daniel
Check the keyframe bedding and key height. I find that a lot of the time, the glides may be down too far giving a higher KH, or the KH may be set too high. Dead giveaway is number of cardboard/paper punching sunder front rail felt. I have found instances of both glides down too far and keys set too high. This sets the key front up higher creating the need for more effort to start the key moving. Getting the correct KH after correctly bedding the keyframe puts the key closer to horizontal, requiring less effort to start the move.
After making sure the glides are set correctly, check KH. I have found S&Ss with 2-3/4" at the middle of the keyboard. Too high. I use business card(s) to shim under the back rail felt at the A3-E4 area, regulate a couple of notes to see what improvements there are. Usually get an even better regulation as well as less effort.
Haven't gone to MA to see David Starwood yet, but just relating my experiences.
Chuck
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[Chuck] [Cook] [RPT]
[Cook's Piano Service
[Griffin] [GA]
[770-229-4298]
[800-390-4298]
Original Message:
Sent: 07-18-2021 23:04
From: Daniel Achten
Subject: S&S New Hammer SW high. Help.
Hello everyone,
I am concerned I will wind up with higher than comfortable inertia.
I am working on a S&S B. I have hung new hammers on new shanks.
The piano is 15-20 years old but was in fairly good shape. It was in a nice cathedral style church with a good pianist who was pleased with the instruments touch and tone. As an aside to this post there was a repetition issue which made us decide to replace hammers, shanks and back checks.
I have hung new S&S hammers on new shanks. I trim, bore, and taper them myself and they progress in weight pretty evenly. Dimensionally they are 11mm at the felt and middle of molding and then taper to 8mm at end of tail. Hammer Pinning is 3g from factory. Old pinning was 2g and less if I remember correctly. Wippen pinning is about 2g. I'm Keeping wippens.
The original set up from the factory was low on the Stanwood chart and is now at the top of middle. I expected to have plenty of head room because of the low original weight but it looks like I'll be at top-middle in the Stanwood chart which is the bottom of concert weight. As an example note 51 is as follows: SW was 8.4g and now is 10.1. FW was and still is 13.4g (very low as far as anything I have been able to read and understand. Correct me if I am wrong). Only 2 leads with a chaser in the bass. DW/UW was 54/35 and is now 62/40. Friction on all samples is an average of 12g. This note is the average example for all my samples.
I have experimented with possibly lightening the hammers but I don't see a way to remove 1-2 grams. I think I can get 0.5 gram. I have tried to trim sides to less than 11mm, considered thinning tail thickness but don't want to make them weak and it seems I would have to take off a fair amount. Treble shanks are already thinned by the factory.
To get balance weight down I need to add key leads in any case as far as I understand.
Here are some questions:
- Can the piano have a lovely touch with a slightly high DW if the BW and inertia are comfortable?
- Any suggestions for proceeding?
- What does replacing brass capstans with WNG to lighten things up accomplish? I have a colleague who has done this. It would lower DW but not strike weight. But what about inertia?
I might be looking at all the numbers cross eyed too or inexperience might be leading me astray.
Thanks!
Daniel
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Daniel Achten
Chattanooga TN
423-760-2458
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