Pianotech

Back to discussions
Expand all | Collapse all

Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

  • 1.  Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Posted 02-24-2020 15:15
    I have a client that has a Mason & Hamlin screw stringer piano. The piano has been restored at some point in its life and is in very good condition. It's about 15 cents flat and was last tuned maybe 5 years ago. Before then he use to have it tuned once a year. The piano sounds great and he's wanting me to tune it. Any advice on screw stringers? Techniques, procedures, things to look out for? 

    Thanks for any and all replies.

    ------------------------------
    Jonathan Walker
    Americus GA
    478-595-1795
    ------------------------------


  • 2.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Posted 02-24-2020 16:29
    * Refer the tuning to another chapter member who has experience with screw stringers or maybe has one in their workshop you can  practice on or  give you pointers,  oh and please don't break a string if you haven't  practised this repair!........
    www.snowpianos.com

    ------------------------------
    Martin Snow
    South Burlington VT
    617-543-1030
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-25-2020 02:30
    Best way to learn is by going ahead and doing it.  The feel is quite different.  In some ways they are easier to tune than the usual old upright.  The strings render quite nicely, without fuss, and what will seem quite strange is the absence of the whole process of setting the pin which is so ingrained in your technique from tuning pianos with tuning pins. Initially, you'll find your approach is rather ham-handed.  With screw-stringers I've found it best to approach the pitch by easing up into it, rather than nudging the pin down from the sharp side.  The "twist" or springiness of tuning pin itself is eerily absent.   You will learn a lot about how tuning pins react by their absence here.  It can be more than a little disconcerting since most of what we do is pure muscle memory.  In a similar fashion when Yamaha used to have these CP70s and the like, the "portable" grands with strings but pickups in place of a soundboard, I learned a lot about the way a soundboard reacts by tuning these, which had none.

    ------------------------------
    Cecil Snyder
    Torrance CA
    310-542-7108
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-25-2020 08:44

    I agree with this, that you don't pull past your target pitch.  It won't need or want to settle back.

    Once you get that, they're easy to tune.  Well – a little tricky to find the correct "pin".

    Ruth

     

    Ruth Zeiner

    215-534-3834 cell

    ruth@alliedpiano.com

     




    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-25-2020 07:33
    Consider leaving it flat, if that doesn't bother the client. Check the whole keyboard and use the pitch that requires the least change over all. You will get the hang of it soon enough, but it is really tricky at first.

    ------------------------------
    Cindy Strehlow, RPT
    Urbana, IL
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Member
    Posted 02-25-2020 05:23
    Use the tuning wrench that came with it, usually tucked inside the case on the left side of the action. Do not try to use the "Mason & Hamlin-like" tuning wrench sold in piano supply houses, they don't work well. If it is not played much, if any, hope the owner will allow you to tune it a little below an A440 temperment. It is a great experiemce to be able to tune one as long as you don't break a string as they are no fun replacing. Have fun and block out extra time to your next appointment.

    ------------------------------
    Kevin Magill
    Williamsburg VA
    757-220-2420
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-25-2020 13:51

    Jonathan,

    Is your customer's piano a grand or an upright?  You don't specify in your message. 

    In any case, let me know if you want a video call on Facetime.  I have a grand and an upright on hand, and I can give you some tuning pointers for either.



    ------------------------------
    Christopher Storch
    Belmont MA
    617-489-6436
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 8.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-25-2020 21:11
    These old upright M-H screw-stringers are rare as hen's teeth to begin with, but I've never seen a grand with this mechanism.   Wasn't aware they made them.   Could you post a photo please?

    ------------------------------
    Cecil Snyder
    Torrance CA
    310-542-7108
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-25-2020 21:24

    Cecil, 

    Mason & Hamlin made a 6' grand (Style 9, or "A"), a 7' grand (Style 8, or "B"), and a 9' grand (Style 14, or "C").  Also made a bunch of different styles of uprights.

    Annotated photos are here at this link.

    https://photos.app.goo.gl/4H9aL6FTM6QhocOm2




    ------------------------------
    Christopher Storch
    Belmont MA
    617-489-6436
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 10.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-26-2020 00:34
    Christopher,
    Thanks so much for this (and for your offer of help in the past). I own a 6' stringer - rosewood w/ empire legs - yet to be rebuilt. Still holds tune well; though tone quality is not up to Mason & Hamlin standards. It came with a zip lock bag of stringer mechanisms (one is broken).
    These are great photos and the best diagrams I've seen.
    Nancy Salmon
    LaVale, MD 21502




    Original Message


  • 11.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-26-2020 08:45

    As an aside, the recent movie "Knives Out" has a Mason & Hamlin screwstringer in the background...



    ------------------------------
    Christopher Storch
    Belmont MA
    617-489-6436
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 12.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Posted 02-26-2020 05:58

    We rebuilt several M&H screw stringer grands in the shop I apprenticed in back in the 1980s. Someone already mentioned that these are tuned by going upwards, towards sharp, as there are no pins to "settle". I thought I'd just add how careful one should be not to damage the part that holds all the screws upright. This part, referred to as the comb, is made of brass. The individual posts are about 1/8" wide and they can easily break off at the base during tuning, especially the ones at the comb's extremities, where there are no neighboring screws to offer some lateral support during tuning. The problem is worse when some oxidation has formed at the tuning nut and the force needed to loosen the nut on the threat exceeds the lateral resistance of the comb post. Wiser after the fact, we first resorted to using a pair of needle nose pliers to hold the screw firmly as the nut was loosened, and on subsequent screw stringer rebuilds we also used a toothpick's worth of machine or penetrating oil in the hole of the nut and let it work overnight before tear-down.

    Incidentally, I have always wondered why the screw stringer system was discontinued. Any ideas, anyone?

    jjg
    Warsaw, Poland



    ------------------------------
    Jean-Jacques Granas
    Warsaw
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 13.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 02-27-2020 01:51
    Thank you for the photo gallery, Christopher.  That was treat.   Personally, I've always thought that Mason-Hamlin never got the credit that they deserved for their attempt to come up with a tuning mechanism that was not only more user-friendly, but resulted in a more stable tuning.  (Whether they succeeded at either would make an interesting discussion.)  Partly, I would blame piano technicians for our natural conservatism.  We can be a grumpy old bunch when confronted with something new, and the history of pianos is littered with evolutionary dead-ends, many of which richly merited their demise.  Or maybe we should admit to being just be a little bit peeved at the effrontery of giving the customer his own tuning lever to play with.  Some years back I used to have an auto mechanic who had a sign in his shop that read:
    Rates:  $10/hour.   $20/hour if you worked on it first.  $40/hour if you want to help.

    ------------------------------
    Cecil Snyder
    Torrance CA
    310-542-7108
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 14.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Posted 02-27-2020 13:48
    "Incidentally, I have always wondered why the screw stringer system was discontinued. Any ideas, anyone?

    jjg
    Warsaw, Poland"

    Must have something to do with money. Too expensive to manufacture maybe? The other thing is that I think it would be frustrating to tune one aurally since the pitch comes up from where you set it. You'd have the pitch set and whoops! it came up... With an ETA you can precisely tune it 3-5 cents flat and it will come up from there. At least that's what worked for me. 

    ------------------------------
    "That Tuning Guy"
    Scott Kerns
    www.thattuningguy.com
    Tunic OnlyPure, TuneLab & PianoMeter user
    ------------------------------

    Original Message


  • 15.  RE: Mason & Hamlin Screw Stringer

    Posted 02-27-2020 14:01
    Jonathan - I've tuned a couple of these and they are "interesting"... The instructions are usually on the left inside with the tuning wrench hanging on it. I think this is one piano that is definitely easier to tune with an ETA. You can tune it about 3 cents flat and it will come up to pitch. Maybe calibrate your device 3-5 cents flat from your target pitch. If the customer understands the risk then give it a try. It will be a good learning experience. Also, I agree that if there's no compelling reason for it to be at A440 then tuning it to about where it is is the way to go.

    ------------------------------
    "That Tuning Guy"
    Scott Kerns
    www.thattuningguy.com
    Tunic OnlyPure, TuneLab & PianoMeter user
    ------------------------------

    Original Message