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Essex action centers

  • 1.  Essex action centers

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 11-24-2023 08:03
      |   view attached

    All-

    I saw a 16 year old Essex grand  this week that had severely sluggish jack and hammer centers which Protek would not remedy. Many centers/pins are green with a verdigris like appearance. Photo attached. I rarely service this brand and am wondering if this is common? I would be suspicious of repinning as a solution if there is already this level of contamination. Anyone familiar with Essex?

    Many thanks in advance.

    DB



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    David C. Brown RPT
    Garland TX
    tunermandb88.com
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  • 2.  RE: Essex action centers

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 11-24-2023 09:05

    David,

    Get some TSI 301 and see what that will do. I for one would be interested. 

    Peter Grey Piano Doctor 



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    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    (603) 686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
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  • 3.  RE: Essex action centers

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 11-24-2023 09:31

    Thanks Peter-

    I have some arriving tomorrow. I ordered it unrelated to this to test it for myself.

    D



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    David C. Brown RPT
    Garland TX
    tunermandb88.com
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  • 4.  RE: Essex action centers

    Posted 11-24-2023 11:14

    I made a video of TSI301 removing Verdigris on action centers and a rep spring.

    "Better to see it with your own eyes, rather than read a claim in an ad it is." Yoda

     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybiMKywjWrM&list=PL4km3jbQ3Am61zjmAuNLDoyD2hRyxQuqR&index=3

    -chris



    ------------------------------
    Chernobieff Piano Restorations

    "The Piano Whisperer"
    Maker of the finest maximum output piano soundboards. (Osage Orange Bridge Caps, Norway Spruce Panels, Engineered Ribs, Sustain Bar)

    Inventor of Inertia Touch Wave (Real Dynamic Inertia Control and Smoothness)

    865-986-7720 (text only please)
    ------------------------------



  • 5.  RE: Essex action centers

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 11-24-2023 13:27

    Has the lubricant under discussion in this thread migrated from TSI321 to TSI301?



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    Alan Eder, RPT
    Herb Alpert School of Music
    California Institute of the Arts
    Valencia, CA
    661.904.6483
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  • 6.  RE: Essex action centers

    Posted 11-24-2023 14:46
    Hi, Alan,

    No...TSI321 is the "undiluted" version. TSI301 is the "diluted" version.

    It's looking like a number of us are experimenting with this stuff. It certainly gets rave reviews from a number of various markets.

    I've ordered both versions; and am hoping to be playing with them soon.

    Kind regards.

    Horace




      Original Message




  • 7.  RE: Essex action centers

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 11-24-2023 16:02

    I wouldn't call it "diluted"  but rather it has a solvent in it intended forbuse with metal. The 321 does not contain this solvent. I believe this is the only difference and the 321 is intended for use where there may be plastic involved.  This assumes I read the website correctly. 

    Peter Grey Piano Doctor 



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    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    (603) 686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 8.  RE: Essex action centers

    Posted 11-24-2023 16:22
    Hi, Peter,

    You are correct. I was incorrectly simplifying.

    It's clear from some of the posts on a couple of sites that cater to competition fishing, different folks use both of these products in similar; yet also different ways. Noted in a couple of posts on one list was that neither of these should be mixed with petroleum-based products.

    Reading the MSDS sheets for the two products makes the differentiation between them clear.

    Hopefully, this will turn out to be something really useful for us.

    Thanks very much.

    Kind regards.

    Horace






      Original Message




  • 9.  RE: Essex action centers

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 11-24-2023 17:13

    Horace,

    Interesting that it is not to be mixed with petroleum products. I take that to mean that they "may not work as intended" if mixed with other stuff. Makes sense. 

    However, when I added a little to my CBL from Jon Page it made a significant difference (i.e. improvement) to the point where I need to limit my application so as not to end up with too little friction. It has made the "truly impossible" ones surprisingly manageable. No apparent side effects thus far. 

    Peter Grey Piano Doctor 



    ------------------------------
    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    (603) 686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 10.  RE: Essex action centers

    Posted 11-24-2023 17:59
    Hi, Peter,

    Thanks!

    What ratio of CBL:TSIxxx do you use?

    At the moment, I think that I would prefer to use TSI321; but, that's based solely on the MSDS information, along with the anecdotal reports on the fishing lists.

    Also, and only FWIW, having worked in a fair variety of micro-climates over the years, I, too, want to find a solution (intentional) that allows for relieving friction without eliminating it.

    Conflating this with another thread: in the Bad Old Daze of Teflon I, when doing a "full" regulation, I removed the solid bushing from the parts, sized the wood; and then refit the bushings prior to doing much pinning. While obviously time consuming, it also provided a much more stable platform for the teflon bushing.

    Thanks again.

    Kind regards.

    Horace




      Original Message




  • 11.  RE: Essex action centers

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 11-24-2023 18:38

    Horace,

    My "guess" is about 5-8% added to CBL. I figured the 301 was good since it's metal to metal (except for the felt). 

    Peter Grey Piano Doctor 



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    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    (603) 686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 12.  RE: Essex action centers

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 11-25-2023 07:35

    I haven't tried out this new-to-piano-technicians lubricant, but what I've read doesn't indicate it is harmless to wooden parts.



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    Patrick Draine RPT
    Billerica MA
    (978) 663-9690
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