Pianotech

They say that you learn from your mistakes.  That being the case my recent experiences with the stupid things I've been doing working on my first full fledged upright restoration project will be providing me with a mother lode of learning.  I am working on a Conway Boston upright which seems to be near the century mark in age.  It had a letoff rail whose adjustment screws were so rusty most could barely be turned and quite a number of them broke.  The letoff buttons themselves were disintegrating so I bought a new set.

Mistake 1:  I got a set of buttons that were larger in size so after I replaced them and the accompanying new adjustment screws even with them backed off all the way the jacks were still in the released state.

Mistake 2:  I have since found out that I could have ordered buttons that were the correct size but I didn't.  Instead I opted for plugging the letoff rail bracket holes on the action rail and re-drilled them slightly higher (the extra height of the new buttons).

Mistake 3:  The back of this action rail (and probably most of them) does not lay flat on a surface so the front of the action rail was at a slight angle when I drilled the new holes on my drill press.  This made the letoff rail brackets tip upwards so that the new location of the letoff rail was very high.  So high, in fact, that most of the letoff adjustments bottomed out before the desired letoff could be achieved.

Mistake 4:  Wanting to get the letoff rail brackets into the right location I plugged the new (2nd) hole again and tried drilling a 3rd hole attempt from the back.  I haven't tried to mount the letoff rail but visually as I look down the line of the tips of the letoff rail brackets I can see that their location varies considerably from one to the other.

So now I'm left with the puzzle of how to dig myself out of this mess.  I'm hoping that I can get some good suggestions from the experts that participate in this forum.  My initial thought is to drill out both of the 1/4" plugs that I put in with a much larger hole (say 1/2"?) and re-plug that hole in order to get a fresh start.  The question, though, is where would I go from there?

Please help.

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX
------------------------------

Order the correct height for the Let Off Buttons.  You should have done that from the start.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 07:43
From: Neil Vanderschaaf
Subject: Letoff rail problems

They say that you learn from your mistakes.  That being the case my recent experiences with the stupid things I've been doing working on my first full fledged upright restoration project will be providing me with a mother lode of learning.  I am working on a Conway Boston upright which seems to be near the century mark in age.  It had a letoff rail whose adjustment screws were so rusty most could barely be turned and quite a number of them broke.  The letoff buttons themselves were disintegrating so I bought a new set.

Mistake 1:  I got a set of buttons that were larger in size so after I replaced them and the accompanying new adjustment screws even with them backed off all the way the jacks were still in the released state.

Mistake 2:  I have since found out that I could have ordered buttons that were the correct size but I didn't.  Instead I opted for plugging the letoff rail bracket holes on the action rail and re-drilled them slightly higher (the extra height of the new buttons).

Mistake 3:  The back of this action rail (and probably most of them) does not lay flat on a surface so the front of the action rail was at a slight angle when I drilled the new holes on my drill press.  This made the letoff rail brackets tip upwards so that the new location of the letoff rail was very high.  So high, in fact, that most of the letoff adjustments bottomed out before the desired letoff could be achieved.

Mistake 4:  Wanting to get the letoff rail brackets into the right location I plugged the new (2nd) hole again and tried drilling a 3rd hole attempt from the back.  I haven't tried to mount the letoff rail but visually as I look down the line of the tips of the letoff rail brackets I can see that their location varies considerably from one to the other.

So now I'm left with the puzzle of how to dig myself out of this mess.  I'm hoping that I can get some good suggestions from the experts that participate in this forum.  My initial thought is to drill out both of the 1/4" plugs that I put in with a much larger hole (say 1/2"?) and re-plug that hole in order to get a fresh start.  The question, though, is where would I go from there?

Please help.

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX
------------------------------

that plus fabricate a new rail with precisely located screws Pictures will help get you better suggestions.

------------------------------
James Kelly
Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
Pawleys Island SC
(843) 325-4357
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 12:40
From: Jon Page
Subject: Letoff rail problems

Order the correct height for the Let Off Buttons.  You should have done that from the start.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 07:43
From: Neil Vanderschaaf
Subject: Letoff rail problems

They say that you learn from your mistakes.  That being the case my recent experiences with the stupid things I've been doing working on my first full fledged upright restoration project will be providing me with a mother lode of learning.  I am working on a Conway Boston upright which seems to be near the century mark in age.  It had a letoff rail whose adjustment screws were so rusty most could barely be turned and quite a number of them broke.  The letoff buttons themselves were disintegrating so I bought a new set.

Mistake 1:  I got a set of buttons that were larger in size so after I replaced them and the accompanying new adjustment screws even with them backed off all the way the jacks were still in the released state.

Mistake 2:  I have since found out that I could have ordered buttons that were the correct size but I didn't.  Instead I opted for plugging the letoff rail bracket holes on the action rail and re-drilled them slightly higher (the extra height of the new buttons).

Mistake 3:  The back of this action rail (and probably most of them) does not lay flat on a surface so the front of the action rail was at a slight angle when I drilled the new holes on my drill press.  This made the letoff rail brackets tip upwards so that the new location of the letoff rail was very high.  So high, in fact, that most of the letoff adjustments bottomed out before the desired letoff could be achieved.

Mistake 4:  Wanting to get the letoff rail brackets into the right location I plugged the new (2nd) hole again and tried drilling a 3rd hole attempt from the back.  I haven't tried to mount the letoff rail but visually as I look down the line of the tips of the letoff rail brackets I can see that their location varies considerably from one to the other.

So now I'm left with the puzzle of how to dig myself out of this mess.  I'm hoping that I can get some good suggestions from the experts that participate in this forum.  My initial thought is to drill out both of the 1/4" plugs that I put in with a much larger hole (say 1/2"?) and re-plug that hole in order to get a fresh start.  The question, though, is where would I go from there?

Please help.

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX
------------------------------

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 16:09
From: James Kelly
Subject: Letoff rail problems

that plus fabricate a new rail with precisely located screws Pictures will help get you better suggestions.

------------------------------
James Kelly
Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
Pawleys Island SC
(843) 325-4357

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 12:40
From: Jon Page
Subject: Letoff rail problems

Order the correct height for the Let Off Buttons.  You should have done that from the start.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 07:43
From: Neil Vanderschaaf
Subject: Letoff rail problems

They say that you learn from your mistakes.  That being the case my recent experiences with the stupid things I've been doing working on my first full fledged upright restoration project will be providing me with a mother lode of learning.  I am working on a Conway Boston upright which seems to be near the century mark in age.  It had a letoff rail whose adjustment screws were so rusty most could barely be turned and quite a number of them broke.  The letoff buttons themselves were disintegrating so I bought a new set.

Mistake 1:  I got a set of buttons that were larger in size so after I replaced them and the accompanying new adjustment screws even with them backed off all the way the jacks were still in the released state.

Mistake 2:  I have since found out that I could have ordered buttons that were the correct size but I didn't.  Instead I opted for plugging the letoff rail bracket holes on the action rail and re-drilled them slightly higher (the extra height of the new buttons).

Mistake 3:  The back of this action rail (and probably most of them) does not lay flat on a surface so the front of the action rail was at a slight angle when I drilled the new holes on my drill press.  This made the letoff rail brackets tip upwards so that the new location of the letoff rail was very high.  So high, in fact, that most of the letoff adjustments bottomed out before the desired letoff could be achieved.

Mistake 4:  Wanting to get the letoff rail brackets into the right location I plugged the new (2nd) hole again and tried drilling a 3rd hole attempt from the back.  I haven't tried to mount the letoff rail but visually as I look down the line of the tips of the letoff rail brackets I can see that their location varies considerably from one to the other.

So now I'm left with the puzzle of how to dig myself out of this mess.  I'm hoping that I can get some good suggestions from the experts that participate in this forum.  My initial thought is to drill out both of the 1/4" plugs that I put in with a much larger hole (say 1/2"?) and re-plug that hole in order to get a fresh start.  The question, though, is where would I go from there?

Please help.

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX
------------------------------

One potential problem I foresee is that with the thick LO buttons, the rail would need to be higher. The jack might bind on the rail while keeping the button over the jack toe. There was a slogan years ago: KWYADAWYADI (Know What You Are Doing And Why You Are Doing It).

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 18:05
From: Neil Vanderschaaf
Subject: Letoff rail problems

Ok.  Here's a picture of the action with the mis-located let off buttons in place.

Making a new let off rail would be easy but I'm not sure how it would solve my problem.

Making a new action rail would probably open up a whole case full of cans of worms.

It's got a cove for the damper rod and mating surfaces for the flanges that would have

to be precisely duplicated.  One of these days I hope to have the equipment to do that

sort of thing but I don't right now.

My current thinking is to take Jon's advice and get the correct size let off buttons.  Drill out

both botched attempts at plugging and replug with a 1/2" dia. plugs (the ones I put in originally

were 1/4").  Then I will need to come up with some kind of shim to allow me to put the back

of the action rail on my drill press such that the front of the action rail would be exactly

perpendicular to the drill bit.

The nice thing about this piano is that it was a freebie.  I do not have a client I will need to apologize

to.  If things turn out really poorly I can take it to the junk yard and hope that the lessons I've learned

will translate into a better job next time.

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 16:09
From: James Kelly
Subject: Letoff rail problems

that plus fabricate a new rail with precisely located screws Pictures will help get you better suggestions.

------------------------------
James Kelly
Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
Pawleys Island SC
(843) 325-4357

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 12:40
From: Jon Page
Subject: Letoff rail problems

Order the correct height for the Let Off Buttons.  You should have done that from the start.

------------------------------
Regards,

Jon Page
mailto:jonpage@comcast.net
http://www.pianocapecod.com

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 07:43
From: Neil Vanderschaaf
Subject: Letoff rail problems

They say that you learn from your mistakes.  That being the case my recent experiences with the stupid things I've been doing working on my first full fledged upright restoration project will be providing me with a mother lode of learning.  I am working on a Conway Boston upright which seems to be near the century mark in age.  It had a letoff rail whose adjustment screws were so rusty most could barely be turned and quite a number of them broke.  The letoff buttons themselves were disintegrating so I bought a new set.

Mistake 1:  I got a set of buttons that were larger in size so after I replaced them and the accompanying new adjustment screws even with them backed off all the way the jacks were still in the released state.

Mistake 2:  I have since found out that I could have ordered buttons that were the correct size but I didn't.  Instead I opted for plugging the letoff rail bracket holes on the action rail and re-drilled them slightly higher (the extra height of the new buttons).

Mistake 3:  The back of this action rail (and probably most of them) does not lay flat on a surface so the front of the action rail was at a slight angle when I drilled the new holes on my drill press.  This made the letoff rail brackets tip upwards so that the new location of the letoff rail was very high.  So high, in fact, that most of the letoff adjustments bottomed out before the desired letoff could be achieved.

Mistake 4:  Wanting to get the letoff rail brackets into the right location I plugged the new (2nd) hole again and tried drilling a 3rd hole attempt from the back.  I haven't tried to mount the letoff rail but visually as I look down the line of the tips of the letoff rail brackets I can see that their location varies considerably from one to the other.

So now I'm left with the puzzle of how to dig myself out of this mess.  I'm hoping that I can get some good suggestions from the experts that participate in this forum.  My initial thought is to drill out both of the 1/4" plugs that I put in with a much larger hole (say 1/2"?) and re-plug that hole in order to get a fresh start.  The question, though, is where would I go from there?

Please help.

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 8/18/2022 7:43:00 AM
From: Neil Vanderschaaf
Subject: Letoff rail problems

They say that you learn from your mistakes.  That being the case my recent experiences with the stupid things I've been doing working on my first full fledged upright restoration project will be providing me with a mother lode of learning.  I am working on a Conway Boston upright which seems to be near the century mark in age.  It had a letoff rail whose adjustment screws were so rusty most could barely be turned and quite a number of them broke.  The letoff buttons themselves were disintegrating so I bought a new set.

Mistake 1:  I got a set of buttons that were larger in size so after I replaced them and the accompanying new adjustment screws even with them backed off all the way the jacks were still in the released state.

Mistake 2:  I have since found out that I could have ordered buttons that were the correct size but I didn't.  Instead I opted for plugging the letoff rail bracket holes on the action rail and re-drilled them slightly higher (the extra height of the new buttons).

Mistake 3:  The back of this action rail (and probably most of them) does not lay flat on a surface so the front of the action rail was at a slight angle when I drilled the new holes on my drill press.  This made the letoff rail brackets tip upwards so that the new location of the letoff rail was very high.  So high, in fact, that most of the letoff adjustments bottomed out before the desired letoff could be achieved.

Mistake 4:  Wanting to get the letoff rail brackets into the right location I plugged the new (2nd) hole again and tried drilling a 3rd hole attempt from the back.  I haven't tried to mount the letoff rail but visually as I look down the line of the tips of the letoff rail brackets I can see that their location varies considerably from one to the other.

So now I'm left with the puzzle of how to dig myself out of this mess.  I'm hoping that I can get some good suggestions from the experts that participate in this forum.  My initial thought is to drill out both of the 1/4" plugs that I put in with a much larger hole (say 1/2"?) and re-plug that hole in order to get a fresh start.  The question, though, is where would I go from there?

Please help.

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX
------------------------------

I take it you have the rest of the piano ? Did you save any of the old letoff buttons ? You will want to keep things as original as possible as far as the letoff rail thickness and location . The rail typically has forks on the front so the letoff buttons can be centered over the jacks. It is critical that each letoff button is centered /aligned to the jack toe and that there is room to make letoff adjustments. Plugging and drilling is a tedious task. If you have the right jig you can get the holes perfectly spaced and drilled in a straight and centered line. Look through some wood working books to see how evenly spaced holes are drilled for adjustable book case shelves. Looking at your picture it appears things are way off  I believe there may be some articles on this subject in past PTG Journals > My opinion is that the task of making a new rail and having new letoff screws and new properly sized buttons will be far easier than using older holes , plugged holes, etc. If you are really struggling try to find some help from a member of a local PTG chapter

------------------------------
James Kelly
Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
Pawleys Island SC
(843) 325-4357
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 08-18-2022 16:13
From: Ruth Zeiner
Subject: Letoff rail problems

Hi Neil,

I thoroughly enjoyed your letter and congratulate you on your grasp of the situation,

attempts made to solve a problem, and especially your openness in laying it out.

Many years ago I read about a company that had an award for "Meritorious

Failed Attempts" or something like that. I loved it!

I'm sure the technicians here will give you good advice. I wish you well

in your adventure with this piano and in those to come in the future.

Ruth Zeinr

 

Original Message:
Sent: 8/18/2022 7:43:00 AM
From: Neil Vanderschaaf
Subject: Letoff rail problems

They say that you learn from your mistakes.  That being the case my recent experiences with the stupid things I've been doing working on my first full fledged upright restoration project will be providing me with a mother lode of learning.  I am working on a Conway Boston upright which seems to be near the century mark in age.  It had a letoff rail whose adjustment screws were so rusty most could barely be turned and quite a number of them broke.  The letoff buttons themselves were disintegrating so I bought a new set.

Mistake 1:  I got a set of buttons that were larger in size so after I replaced them and the accompanying new adjustment screws even with them backed off all the way the jacks were still in the released state.

Mistake 2:  I have since found out that I could have ordered buttons that were the correct size but I didn't.  Instead I opted for plugging the letoff rail bracket holes on the action rail and re-drilled them slightly higher (the extra height of the new buttons).

Mistake 3:  The back of this action rail (and probably most of them) does not lay flat on a surface so the front of the action rail was at a slight angle when I drilled the new holes on my drill press.  This made the letoff rail brackets tip upwards so that the new location of the letoff rail was very high.  So high, in fact, that most of the letoff adjustments bottomed out before the desired letoff could be achieved.

Mistake 4:  Wanting to get the letoff rail brackets into the right location I plugged the new (2nd) hole again and tried drilling a 3rd hole attempt from the back.  I haven't tried to mount the letoff rail but visually as I look down the line of the tips of the letoff rail brackets I can see that their location varies considerably from one to the other.

So now I'm left with the puzzle of how to dig myself out of this mess.  I'm hoping that I can get some good suggestions from the experts that participate in this forum.  My initial thought is to drill out both of the 1/4" plugs that I put in with a much larger hole (say 1/2"?) and re-plug that hole in order to get a fresh start.  The question, though, is where would I go from there?

Please help.

------------------------------
Neil Vanderschaaf
Round Rock TX
------------------------------