Pianotech

About 2 years ago, I posted about the "choked" tone on a Steinway L from 1981.  The advice I received was to check on the down bearing, especially after taking the tension down. Also to check on the shape of the v-bar.   I did not take the tension down, but I did measure the down bearing on a Wixey angle gauge attached to a shop made foot copied from the photo in Mario Igrec's tome (photo was of the said device made by Jim Ialeggio.)

The average composite bearing at tension for the treble capo section was 2.4 degrees.  For the high treble, 3.9 degrees. at d#4 2.3 degrees and c#5, 2.1 degrees.  B0 was 2.8 degrees, a#1 1.3 degrees. B2 was 0.8 degrees.

Additional findings were 2mm or more crown at the longest rib. Hammers are hardened intensely. I discovered a gooey substance on the strings all along the capo, which cleaned off easiest with denatured alcohol.

So far the actions I took: I filed both capo sections to a V (perhaps even to the satisfaction of Ed McMorrow, ha)

 After cleaning the goo from the capo and strings and resetting to tension, sustain was markedly improved, but still lacking.  This gooey substance is present across all strings.  I have not treated/cleaned the tenor or bass sections.  Bass especially is choked.  I don't know what the substance is, but based on how readily it removed with denatured alcohol makes wonder if it could be shellac? And why would it be present across the piano? The treble and high treble hammers are colored slightly yellow in the string grooves. 

It seems that the down bearing is still causing the "choking" tone, but I have never diagnosed anything similar to be confident about that.  I would be very interested to correct the down bearing if possible, though I do not have a shop space that allows for an entire piano to be brought in for corrections. 

Any further thoughts or advice would be most welcome.  I will revisit this piano tomorrow.

You're witnessing what i call, the Steinway Sabotage. Its a combo in the treble of excessive downbearing, a too thin soundboard panel, and a missing rib (most mfg's had 12 or 13 ribs for a 6', Steinway has 11).

1. Try adding a riblet.
2. Also try loosening  all strings, remove off of hitch pins, remove the string rest and shim it( i use brass). 
3. Put all back together again.

-chris

About 2 years ago, I posted about the "choked" tone on a Steinway L from 1981.  The advice I received was to check on the down bearing, especially after taking the tension down. Also to check on the shape of the v-bar.   I did not take the tension down, but I did measure the down bearing on a Wixey angle gauge attached to a shop made foot copied from the photo in Mario Igrec's tome (photo was of the said device made by Jim Ialeggio.)

The average composite bearing at tension for the treble capo section was 2.4 degrees.  For the high treble, 3.9 degrees. at d#4 2.3 degrees and c#5, 2.1 degrees.  B0 was 2.8 degrees, a#1 1.3 degrees. B2 was 0.8 degrees.

Additional findings were 2mm or more crown at the longest rib. Hammers are hardened intensely. I discovered a gooey substance on the strings all along the capo, which cleaned off easiest with denatured alcohol.

So far the actions I took: I filed both capo sections to a V (perhaps even to the satisfaction of Ed McMorrow, ha)

 After cleaning the goo from the capo and strings and resetting to tension, sustain was markedly improved, but still lacking.  This gooey substance is present across all strings.  I have not treated/cleaned the tenor or bass sections.  Bass especially is choked.  I don't know what the substance is, but based on how readily it removed with denatured alcohol makes wonder if it could be shellac? And why would it be present across the piano? The treble and high treble hammers are colored slightly yellow in the string grooves. 

It seems that the down bearing is still causing the "choking" tone, but I have never diagnosed anything similar to be confident about that.  I would be very interested to correct the down bearing if possible, though I do not have a shop space that allows for an entire piano to be brought in for corrections. 

Any further thoughts or advice would be most welcome.  I will revisit this piano tomorrow.

I would agree with Chris here. I have found over the years enough instances of this to be pretty confident of a diagnosis. Massively excessive and/or uneven downbearing being the primary culprit. 

You will need to remove all tension, then recheck the crown (probably quite a bit more now), I would use a string to measure DB requiring spot removal of some strings. Then as Chris said shim the aliquots and whatever other string rests are there to achieve a light DB load. 

If it does what I expect you will need to soften those super hard hammers as the volume will be enormous (this is why they juiced the hammers to the max in the first place because they were getting "nothing" out of the piano due to excessive DB). 

Restringing completely would be the ideal thing but since you don't have the facilities (unless you do it on site) this will be the best you can do.

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

You're witnessing what i call, the Steinway Sabotage. Its a combo in the treble of excessive downbearing, a too thin soundboard panel, and a missing rib (most mfg's had 12 or 13 ribs for a 6', Steinway has 11).

1. Try adding a riblet.
2. Also try loosening  all strings, remove off of hitch pins, remove the string rest and shim it( i use brass). 
3. Put all back together again.

-chris

About 2 years ago, I posted about the "choked" tone on a Steinway L from 1981.  The advice I received was to check on the down bearing, especially after taking the tension down. Also to check on the shape of the v-bar.   I did not take the tension down, but I did measure the down bearing on a Wixey angle gauge attached to a shop made foot copied from the photo in Mario Igrec's tome (photo was of the said device made by Jim Ialeggio.)

The average composite bearing at tension for the treble capo section was 2.4 degrees.  For the high treble, 3.9 degrees. at d#4 2.3 degrees and c#5, 2.1 degrees.  B0 was 2.8 degrees, a#1 1.3 degrees. B2 was 0.8 degrees.

Additional findings were 2mm or more crown at the longest rib. Hammers are hardened intensely. I discovered a gooey substance on the strings all along the capo, which cleaned off easiest with denatured alcohol.

So far the actions I took: I filed both capo sections to a V (perhaps even to the satisfaction of Ed McMorrow, ha)

 After cleaning the goo from the capo and strings and resetting to tension, sustain was markedly improved, but still lacking.  This gooey substance is present across all strings.  I have not treated/cleaned the tenor or bass sections.  Bass especially is choked.  I don't know what the substance is, but based on how readily it removed with denatured alcohol makes wonder if it could be shellac? And why would it be present across the piano? The treble and high treble hammers are colored slightly yellow in the string grooves. 

It seems that the down bearing is still causing the "choking" tone, but I have never diagnosed anything similar to be confident about that.  I would be very interested to correct the down bearing if possible, though I do not have a shop space that allows for an entire piano to be brought in for corrections. 

Any further thoughts or advice would be most welcome.  I will revisit this piano tomorrow.

I would agree with Chris here. I have found over the years enough instances of this to be pretty confident of a diagnosis. Massively excessive and/or uneven downbearing being the primary culprit. 

You will need to remove all tension, then recheck the crown (probably quite a bit more now), I would use a string to measure DB requiring spot removal of some strings. Then as Chris said shim the aliquots and whatever other string rests are there to achieve a light DB load. 

If it does what I expect you will need to soften those super hard hammers as the volume will be enormous (this is why they juiced the hammers to the max in the first place because they were getting "nothing" out of the piano due to excessive DB). 

Restringing completely would be the ideal thing but since you don't have the facilities (unless you do it on site) this will be the best you can do.

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

You're witnessing what i call, the Steinway Sabotage. Its a combo in the treble of excessive downbearing, a too thin soundboard panel, and a missing rib (most mfg's had 12 or 13 ribs for a 6', Steinway has 11).

1. Try adding a riblet.
2. Also try loosening  all strings, remove off of hitch pins, remove the string rest and shim it( i use brass). 
3. Put all back together again.

-chris

About 2 years ago, I posted about the "choked" tone on a Steinway L from 1981.  The advice I received was to check on the down bearing, especially after taking the tension down. Also to check on the shape of the v-bar.   I did not take the tension down, but I did measure the down bearing on a Wixey angle gauge attached to a shop made foot copied from the photo in Mario Igrec's tome (photo was of the said device made by Jim Ialeggio.)

The average composite bearing at tension for the treble capo section was 2.4 degrees.  For the high treble, 3.9 degrees. at d#4 2.3 degrees and c#5, 2.1 degrees.  B0 was 2.8 degrees, a#1 1.3 degrees. B2 was 0.8 degrees.

Additional findings were 2mm or more crown at the longest rib. Hammers are hardened intensely. I discovered a gooey substance on the strings all along the capo, which cleaned off easiest with denatured alcohol.

So far the actions I took: I filed both capo sections to a V (perhaps even to the satisfaction of Ed McMorrow, ha)

 After cleaning the goo from the capo and strings and resetting to tension, sustain was markedly improved, but still lacking.  This gooey substance is present across all strings.  I have not treated/cleaned the tenor or bass sections.  Bass especially is choked.  I don't know what the substance is, but based on how readily it removed with denatured alcohol makes wonder if it could be shellac? And why would it be present across the piano? The treble and high treble hammers are colored slightly yellow in the string grooves. 

It seems that the down bearing is still causing the "choking" tone, but I have never diagnosed anything similar to be confident about that.  I would be very interested to correct the down bearing if possible, though I do not have a shop space that allows for an entire piano to be brought in for corrections. 

Any further thoughts or advice would be most welcome.  I will revisit this piano tomorrow.

You're witnessing what i call, the Steinway Sabotage. Its a combo in the treble of excessive downbearing, a too thin soundboard panel, and a missing rib (most mfg's had 12 or 13 ribs for a 6', Steinway has 11).

1. Try adding a riblet.
2. Also try loosening  all strings, remove off of hitch pins, remove the string rest and shim it( i use brass). 
3. Put all back together again.

-chris

About 2 years ago, I posted about the "choked" tone on a Steinway L from 1981.  The advice I received was to check on the down bearing, especially after taking the tension down. Also to check on the shape of the v-bar.   I did not take the tension down, but I did measure the down bearing on a Wixey angle gauge attached to a shop made foot copied from the photo in Mario Igrec's tome (photo was of the said device made by Jim Ialeggio.)

The average composite bearing at tension for the treble capo section was 2.4 degrees.  For the high treble, 3.9 degrees. at d#4 2.3 degrees and c#5, 2.1 degrees.  B0 was 2.8 degrees, a#1 1.3 degrees. B2 was 0.8 degrees.

Additional findings were 2mm or more crown at the longest rib. Hammers are hardened intensely. I discovered a gooey substance on the strings all along the capo, which cleaned off easiest with denatured alcohol.

So far the actions I took: I filed both capo sections to a V (perhaps even to the satisfaction of Ed McMorrow, ha)

 After cleaning the goo from the capo and strings and resetting to tension, sustain was markedly improved, but still lacking.  This gooey substance is present across all strings.  I have not treated/cleaned the tenor or bass sections.  Bass especially is choked.  I don't know what the substance is, but based on how readily it removed with denatured alcohol makes wonder if it could be shellac? And why would it be present across the piano? The treble and high treble hammers are colored slightly yellow in the string grooves. 

It seems that the down bearing is still causing the "choking" tone, but I have never diagnosed anything similar to be confident about that.  I would be very interested to correct the down bearing if possible, though I do not have a shop space that allows for an entire piano to be brought in for corrections. 

Any further thoughts or advice would be most welcome.  I will revisit this piano tomorrow.