Pianotech

  • 1.  Piano Rentals

    Posted 05-06-2014 15:40
    Anyone here dabble in renting pianos?  I'm curious what your experience has been, where you find rental clients, how long do people typically rent the piano, do you have the client pay all or some of the moving costs, etc.  I've received some great input from a local colleague of mine but enjoy hearing a variety of experiences to help me decide how I want to proceed, or even if I want to move forward with it at all!  Tell me the good, bad & the ugly.  Thanks!

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    Corena Casemy
    Owner Technician
    Miss Piano Tuner
    Snoqualmie, WA
    (425) 281-2849
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  • 2.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Posted 05-06-2014 16:18
    I rent pianos for occasions. There is a month long Jazz Festival in July which is a good gig. Rental fee includes all moving and tuning expenses, paid in advance. For vacationers, renting for a month or longer, I would sell it to them with a predetermined price option of buying it back at the end of the period. This way, they are on the hook for any finish damage.

    Once I rented a newly refinished S&S M to a wedding. They used it for a gift depository, despite my instructions. It took four hours to re-rub out the lid. My rentals are nice but not perfect finishes now for that reason.

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    Regards,

    Jon Page


  • 3.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-06-2014 17:29
    Hi Corena!

    You're in Roger Gable's area.  He has a fleet of Yamahas (mostly) rents all around including Centrum in Port Townsend every summer. He's been at it for decades. Ask him for advise.  Maybe a south and east person might help.  He has his own moving company with his brother in law.  they do pretty well with it.



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    Paul T. Williams RPT
    Piano Technician
    Glenn Korff School of Music
    University of Nebraska
    Lincoln, NE 68588-0100
    pwilliams4@unl.edu
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  • 4.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-06-2014 17:35
    Corena

    I did that for a while in Missouri. At one time I had over 125 pianos out on retal. It takes a lot of capital to acquire the pianos. I used money from my day to day tuning and repair business to buy the piano, but later on, since I also sold new piano, I used all the money available to do that.

    You need to establish a contract that you can live with. I used the rental contract from Aaron's as a template. It contained all the legal language, but adopted for my own situation.

    When I bought a piano, I paid a mover to take it to my place. When I rented a piano, the customer paid for moving the piano to their house, and also paid to have it moved back. I also collected one month rent. So the up front cost was kind of high. They got a coupon book, just like when you buy a car. But you can also have the customer use a credit card for payment. That's much easier, but you have to make sure you keep up with the expiration date.

    I had a clause in the contract that required the renter to pay me to tune the piano every 6 months. But that was hard to enforce. Why have a renter return the piano just because they didn't have it tuned?

    The rental income was very good money. I charged the equivalent of paying off the piano at 18% interest over 5 years. I allowed the renter to buy the piano, with 100% of the first 6 months, 50% of the second six months, and 25% of the third six months applied to the purchase price. The purchase price was higher than the piano would normally sell. So when the customer did buy the piano, I got top dollar for it. 

    Renters would rent between 6 months and a couple of years.   

    Now the bad news. If they don't pay, unless they cooperate, it is very difficulty to get the piano back. You can go to court, but that costs  money. When you get the ruling that the customer has to return the piano, that's all that is. A ruling. If they don't abide by it, by the time you pay the sheriff, and the movers, to execute the judge's order, you might be better off just letting the customer keep the piano.

    Basically, customers who don't pay the rent on their piano probably are dead beats in other areas, and they know how to beat the system.
    One thing I didn't do was run a credit check on each customers because it costs extra. But my philosophy has always been, that people who are interested in music are a cut above the average scum, and the chances of getting a deadbeat are slim. Over the 8 years I ran my rental business, I probably had over 500 pianos come and go. Of those, only 5 wound up being dead beats. But it's hard to figure out who will be one, as one of those deadbeats was a multimillionaire, who rented 2 pianos, one for his house, and one for his ex-wife's house, so that his daughter could play.

    I sold my rental business when I left St. Louis, but there were 5 customers who were dead beats.  Even with the help of a lawyer, one of them gave me one more month, but the rest vanished, with my pianos.

    Good luck.
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    Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
    Mililani, HI 96789
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  • 5.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Posted 05-06-2014 20:17
    It's the old adage: "I didn't have a problem with the $50.00 down payment, it was the $50/month..."

    I've rented long term to restaurants. They paid the move-in/move/out fee with first and last month's rent. For the entire contract, that was all they paid. It wasn't worth going after them, I just let it ride out.

    There are different kinds of rentals. Commercial, private and function.

    If someone dosen't have the funds, there are plenty of free pianos on craigslist. I don't want to gamble with my investment for a long term commercial or private rental, vertical pianos that I would rent out long term are low priced anyway (under 2K), grands are out of the question. Besides, what retail price are we talking about? The cost of the rental is 50 to 75% of what they could have purchased it. So they buy the piano, I'll buy it back, less the rental proportion. I have a deal with the bank, they do not sell pianos and I do not lend money. Take it from Ben Franklin: "A borrower nor a lender be."

    On a rental, the insurance and liability of damage is all yours. Yeah, you can sue, at a cost; and not guaranteed a return. On a purchase, the liability for damage is theirs.

    That's why I have settled on short term, move-in/move-out dates on the contract; paid in full prior to delivery. The majority of my rentals are for one day events with the exception of the Jazz Festival but all are paid in advance. My short term grand rental's retail price is not under 2K and is very nice and not for sale, it is too valuable as rental product. I will replace it and sell it when something suitable comes along, as I have done so twice in the past five years.

    At present, I have two verticals for sale which could be rented for a day/very short term. I have one dedicated rental grand and 2 others that could be pressed into service. So far the dedicated rental grand is rented for 2 different week ends (1 day each) in June and for the month of July.

    I do my own moving which helps tremendously in the scheme of things.

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    Regards,

    Jon Page


  • 6.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Posted 05-06-2014 20:28
    In addition to the trailer, ramps, dollies, pads and straps, the most beneficial tool I use for moving grands is the MoonDog Piano Tilter. Everyone is amazed at how almost effortless it is to place a grand on its side or right it. It made moving a 9' Baldwin to my shop yesterday a piece of cake.
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    Regards,

    Jon Page
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    I do my own moving which helps tremendously in the scheme of things.





  • 7.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-07-2014 11:17
    Hi Corena,

    Everyone has pretty well covered the hazards on this.  I've delved into this on a very limited basis using old spinets and consoles to get the feel for that part of the business. 

    It creates a little more office work keeping tract each month on who's paid and who hasn't.

    I used postcard payment reminders, did my own moving and pick up, charged in advance for delivery, pick up, and the first month's rent.

    Pianos were delivered freshly tuned.  It was the renter's problem after that.

    Lack of payment became the bottom line of concern.  How do you gain access to a renter's home to retrieve a deadbeat's rental piano??  The cost is high as has been indicated.  I included a retrieval clause in the contract  ......  renter pays all expenses should they become delinquent.

    Rent was cheap  ....  $30/mo and so that became the incentive however, you can buy a piano for a little more a month providing you can get financing.  Those who can't get financing you shouldn't rent to.  Those who's eyes of desire are bigger than they can keep under control are expensive people to do business with.

    Risk of damage (drunks spilling and puking, aquariums, plants, rhinestone purses, riveted jeans, benches used as rocking chairs) was the highest of all piano owners.

    I don't need to be that busy to make a living.  I've been at this for over 40 years and I'm ready to slow down.  So far, so good.

    It's my impression that things don't pencil out unless you can do a larger volume with a minimal overhead (own the pianos free and clear, do your own moving, free storage and do you own tuning and repairs).  Dealers use the rental expense as a potential for sales.  When a rental piano sells, the pay off is quite profitable.  Acquiring and liquidating the rental fleet should be factored in as well.  Lately, selling pianos from my living room isn't panning out.  Overall, the desire for a piano is fading worldwide.

    Good luck.


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    Larry Fisher
    Owner, Chief Grunt, Head Hosehead
    Vancouver WA
    360-256-2999
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  • 8.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-06-2014 19:38


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    Roger Gable
    Gable Piano
    Everett WA
    425-252-5000
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    Corena,
    There are two distinct categories in the piano rental business - performance and in-home. One can't "dabble" in performance rentals as you must presume a serious frame of mind toward the quality and availability of your pianos and service. You must consider owning your own truck and moving personnel since performance rentals require frequent moving - picking up a performance piano at 11:00 p.m. is not uncommon. Unless you have no competition, I believe one would have difficulty making money in the performance rental business without a service area of about 2 million people. As for in-home rental, I'm sure there are others on this list who are more qualified to answer your question.
     
    Roger Gable







  • 9.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Posted 05-07-2014 19:24

    Thank you everyone!  This was exactly what I was looking for.  Sorry I didn't specify, I'm not looking into doing performance rentals, I want to try my hand at in-home rentals but of course I want to make sure it's worth my time and effort.  Everyone gave me some great food for thought.  I already have a couple of small pianos in good condition that I got for free, so I might start with those and see where I go from there.  Again, great input, thanks again! 
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    Corena Casemy
    Owner Technician
    Miss Piano Tuner
    Snoqualmie, WA
    (425) 281-2849
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  • 10.  RE:Piano Rentals

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-07-2014 19:27
    Just home rentals.  Talk to Dean Petrich on whidbey Island (Seattle chapter).  He has lots of experience on that!

    And good luck to you.


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    Paul T. Williams RPT
    Piano Technician
    Glenn Korff School of Music
    University of Nebraska
    Lincoln, NE 68588-0100
    pwilliams4@unl.edu
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