Pianotech

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

Tim,

I have used the method outlined in Bruce's article as well as other approaches. (BTW, I do not recommend using a broken screw extractor!)

For the next broken agraffe I encounter, I plan to use a "left-handed drill bit," which sounds very promising. Punch a divot in the top of the post to prevent the drill bit from skating (I use an automatic center punch for this) and then go at it with the counter-clockwise bit in a drill motor in reverse which, I am told, has a very high batting average at successfully unscrewing the broken post from the string frame (AKA plate).

Please do let us know which approach you wind up taking and regale us with the tale of your victory!

Best,

Alan

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Norman, why dull it?

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Dulling the bit may be beneficial for drilling a hole, and if that is your purpose, then fine.  In regards to drilling out an agraffe with a left-handed bit, you don't want to dull the bit.  Just the opposite.  You want it to dig in so that it will catch the stem and turn it out.  If you're using a regular extraction tool like an Easy-Out, then drilling a hole is fine and dulling the bit would be appropriate.  

Having said that, I wish someone would make a tool that would center-punch a broken agraffe in the center of the stem.  It would make the process of drilling it on center a lot easier for whatever procedure you want to do.  Roger G?

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Paul, that is a great point (I was thinking about that as well on my drive to the shop today). 

As to a method of centering, I was thinking about taking a spring loaded automatic center punch, measuring the diameter of the punch and drilling through the center of a 1/4" or 7/32" brass cylinder at the same diameter as the punch. It seems like this would center the punch really well.

Dulling the bit may be beneficial for drilling a hole, and if that is your purpose, then fine.  In regards to drilling out an agraffe with a left-handed bit, you don't want to dull the bit.  Just the opposite.  You want it to dig in so that it will catch the stem and turn it out.  If you're using a regular extraction tool like an Easy-Out, then drilling a hole is fine and dulling the bit would be appropriate.  

Having said that, I wish someone would make a tool that would center-punch a broken agraffe in the center of the stem.  It would make the process of drilling it on center a lot easier for whatever procedure you want to do.  Roger G?

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Paul, that is a great point (I was thinking about that as well on my drive to the shop today). 

As to a method of centering, I was thinking about taking a spring loaded automatic center punch, measuring the diameter of the punch and drilling through the center of a 1/4" or 7/32" brass cylinder at the same diameter as the punch. It seems like this would center the punch really well.

Dulling the bit may be beneficial for drilling a hole, and if that is your purpose, then fine.  In regards to drilling out an agraffe with a left-handed bit, you don't want to dull the bit.  Just the opposite.  You want it to dig in so that it will catch the stem and turn it out.  If you're using a regular extraction tool like an Easy-Out, then drilling a hole is fine and dulling the bit would be appropriate.  

Having said that, I wish someone would make a tool that would center-punch a broken agraffe in the center of the stem.  It would make the process of drilling it on center a lot easier for whatever procedure you want to do.  Roger G?

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Another thing I would suggest is using a good penetrating oil before starting to remove the old agraffe stem.  Kroil Penetrating Oil is what I use and it is hard to beat.  WD-40 would be better than nothing.  Ideally apply the day before you remove the stem.  Of course, do not get any oil into the tuning pins or pinblock!  

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

It looks like it would work if the stem is below the surface.  Otherwise it will sit up on top of the stem.  The outside diameter should be close to the same size as the round "land", but there must be a shallow hole drilled in the middle at least the same size as the stem.  That will allow the tool to sit down on the surface centered.  So, with this bronze bearing you are recommending, you need to enlarge the hole a little bit on one end.  1/4" OD might be a tad too small, but then I"m not at a piano to measure it.  Maybe I'll order one and play with it.  I'm working on a broken agraffe project now, although I already removed the stem with a lefthanded bit.  

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

They do make self-centering drill bit rigs in 1/4" and 7/32" sizes. Might work will to get the hole started.

It looks like it would work if the stem is below the surface.  Otherwise it will sit up on top of the stem.  The outside diameter should be close to the same size as the round "land", but there must be a shallow hole drilled in the middle at least the same size as the stem.  That will allow the tool to sit down on the surface centered.  So, with this bronze bearing you are recommending, you need to enlarge the hole a little bit on one end.  1/4" OD might be a tad too small, but then I"m not at a piano to measure it.  Maybe I'll order one and play with it.  I'm working on a broken agraffe project now, although I already removed the stem with a lefthanded bit.  

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

They do make self-centering drill bit rigs in 1/4" and 7/32" sizes. Might work will to get the hole started.

It looks like it would work if the stem is below the surface.  Otherwise it will sit up on top of the stem.  The outside diameter should be close to the same size as the round "land", but there must be a shallow hole drilled in the middle at least the same size as the stem.  That will allow the tool to sit down on the surface centered.  So, with this bronze bearing you are recommending, you need to enlarge the hole a little bit on one end.  1/4" OD might be a tad too small, but then I"m not at a piano to measure it.  Maybe I'll order one and play with it.  I'm working on a broken agraffe project now, although I already removed the stem with a lefthanded bit.  

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Good idea.  Get a washer the size of the circle around the stem (I call it a land), maybe 1/2" ?.  If the hole in the washer is the right size, the washer will guide the jig and center the bit over the stem.  We'd have to experiment to get the right size washer and drill jig. 

I haven't seen a drill guide jig that uses a 1/4" drill bit.  The biggest I've seen is 11/64", which is slightly less than 3/16".  Who knows, maybe that size would work.  I'll try it next time.

They do make self-centering drill bit rigs in 1/4" and 7/32" sizes. Might work will to get the hole started.

It looks like it would work if the stem is below the surface.  Otherwise it will sit up on top of the stem.  The outside diameter should be close to the same size as the round "land", but there must be a shallow hole drilled in the middle at least the same size as the stem.  That will allow the tool to sit down on the surface centered.  So, with this bronze bearing you are recommending, you need to enlarge the hole a little bit on one end.  1/4" OD might be a tad too small, but then I"m not at a piano to measure it.  Maybe I'll order one and play with it.  I'm working on a broken agraffe project now, although I already removed the stem with a lefthanded bit.  

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Paul, it is a 1980s Howard (Baldwin), I hope the agraffe is a standard size…

Good idea.  Get a washer the size of the circle around the stem (I call it a land), maybe 1/2" ?.  If the hole in the washer is the right size, the washer will guide the jig and center the bit over the stem.  We'd have to experiment to get the right size washer and drill jig. 

I haven't seen a drill guide jig that uses a 1/4" drill bit.  The biggest I've seen is 11/64", which is slightly less than 3/16".  Who knows, maybe that size would work.  I'll try it next time.

They do make self-centering drill bit rigs in 1/4" and 7/32" sizes. Might work will to get the hole started.

It looks like it would work if the stem is below the surface.  Otherwise it will sit up on top of the stem.  The outside diameter should be close to the same size as the round "land", but there must be a shallow hole drilled in the middle at least the same size as the stem.  That will allow the tool to sit down on the surface centered.  So, with this bronze bearing you are recommending, you need to enlarge the hole a little bit on one end.  1/4" OD might be a tad too small, but then I"m not at a piano to measure it.  Maybe I'll order one and play with it.  I'm working on a broken agraffe project now, although I already removed the stem with a lefthanded bit.  

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Paul, it is a 1980s Howard (Baldwin), I hope the agraffe is a standard size…

Good idea.  Get a washer the size of the circle around the stem (I call it a land), maybe 1/2" ?.  If the hole in the washer is the right size, the washer will guide the jig and center the bit over the stem.  We'd have to experiment to get the right size washer and drill jig. 

I haven't seen a drill guide jig that uses a 1/4" drill bit.  The biggest I've seen is 11/64", which is slightly less than 3/16".  Who knows, maybe that size would work.  I'll try it next time.

They do make self-centering drill bit rigs in 1/4" and 7/32" sizes. Might work will to get the hole started.

It looks like it would work if the stem is below the surface.  Otherwise it will sit up on top of the stem.  The outside diameter should be close to the same size as the round "land", but there must be a shallow hole drilled in the middle at least the same size as the stem.  That will allow the tool to sit down on the surface centered.  So, with this bronze bearing you are recommending, you need to enlarge the hole a little bit on one end.  1/4" OD might be a tad too small, but then I"m not at a piano to measure it.  Maybe I'll order one and play with it.  I'm working on a broken agraffe project now, although I already removed the stem with a lefthanded bit.  

I may try this, thoughts?

https://a.co/d/hkgMM6B

Funny that you make that comment about a center punch.  I just sent a message to Roger Gable, suggesting exactly the same thing, a special tool that would center a drill bit for drilling agraffes.  I'd buy one in a heartbeat!   Another tool could be created that would center a drill bit while you're drilling so that the hole would not end up going off center.  A handheld drill is difficult to use to make a hole perfectly perpendicular.  Maybe you wouldn't need a center punch with a tool like that.

Norman, I did a little research and it looks like you're spot on! Because brass is soft (compared to steel), a sharp bit has the tendency to "grab and dig" into the metal much faster, making it more difficult to control.  Thanks for the tip!

Tim and Peter, it's standard procedure that I was taught -- assuming that you are using high speed steel drill bits.  Take a file length-wise parallel with the shaft of the drill bit and file/take the sharp tip off the end of the drill bit.  DO NOT do this if you are going to be drilling, say, iron with the drill bit.  But brass is soft -- the drill bit can seize up (or perhaps give a rough hole). I was taught this many years ago in doing machining projects with brass.  Using a drill with an adjustable clutch I figure is back-up, extra caution, more of the same should the drill bit catch in the agraffe.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:44
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Yeah, why dull it? Inquiring minds want to know...

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 21:26
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Norman, why dull it?

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 19:24
From: Norman Brickman
Subject: Broken agraffe

Tim, be sure to slightly dull the left-handed drill bit -- it is (soft) brass that you are drilling into.  And be sure to use a drill with a clutch.  Regards, Norman.

------------------------------
Norman Brickman
Potomac Piano Service
Potomac, Maryland
potomacpiano@verizon.net
https://potomacpiano.com
(301) 983.9321

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 17:40
From: Peter Grey
Subject: Broken agraffe

Left hand bit for me (its part of my seldom used agraffe kit).  Even if it does not come out on its own at least your drilling process has been in the correct direction and may have slightly "persuaded" it properly. 

Edit: Now if fixing my kitchen sink faucet could be so easy...argghhh! It's toast and needs replacement!

Peter Grey Piano Doctor 

------------------------------
Peter Grey
Stratham NH
(603) 686-2395
pianodoctor57@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 14:02
From: Daniel DeBiasio
Subject: Broken agraffe

A left hand drill bit often does everything you need. If the left hand drill bit doesn't walk out the stump on its own, a soft material extractor works great.

The 1/8" extractor for soft material and thin walled parts only comes in a kit linked below, but I've found it to be very effective.  The left hand drill bit for the corresponding extractor is linked below as well.

https://www.mcmaster.com/88055A45/

https://www.mcmaster.com/8289A11/

------------------------------
Daniel DeBiasio
Technical Education & Support
ddebiasio@steinway.com
718-267-3229
Steinway & Sons

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

Hi Tim,

You've gotten a lot of good responses. Here are a few items:

• If there's any portion of the stud sticking up at all, I've found the simplest, easiest, least intrusive approach is screw removing pliers. 
   

  
• If that isn't an option, I use a center punch to mark the center of the stud and use the lefthand spiral drill bit. I work very slowly and hope that the agraffe just backs out (which it usually does) and I'm ready to move forward. If it doesn't then I'm already drilling my hole for deeper work.
• If the threads are contaminated (sugary drink, urine, etc.) then I apply a few drops of penetrating oil and let it set for a bit before extracting. Galling is seldom a problem with agraffes due to the dissimilar metals (cast iron and brass)
• The screwdriver mentioned is easily modified or you can purchase something even more focused from Ferree's Tools as a D14 Sax Neck Screw Extractor.
• Definite focus should be paid to shoulder depth and height of the string plane. This can be measured and duplicated (reducing with a counterbore or increasing with agraffe washer) since agraffe production has changed over the years even on standard brands. 
• A supply of brass agraffe washers should always be carried to properly orient the stringholes to the scale line.
• Standard agraffe taps should always be used to chase the threads in the plate to avoid stripping or seizing the threads.
• If the hole is already mangled (most often from improper extraction techniques) or an odd-size agraffe thread, a group of Schaff (formerly from Pianotek) 927-ARI agraffe inserts live in my agraffe field kit along with the appropriate drills, taps, etc. 

I hope this helps!

AG

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

Hi Tim,

You've gotten a lot of good responses. Here are a few items:

• If there's any portion of the stud sticking up at all, I've found the simplest, easiest, least intrusive approach is screw removing pliers. 
   

  
• If that isn't an option, I use a center punch to mark the center of the stud and use the lefthand spiral drill bit. I work very slowly and hope that the agraffe just backs out (which it usually does) and I'm ready to move forward. If it doesn't then I'm already drilling my hole for deeper work.
• If the threads are contaminated (sugary drink, urine, etc.) then I apply a few drops of penetrating oil and let it set for a bit before extracting. Galling is seldom a problem with agraffes due to the dissimilar metals (cast iron and brass)
• The screwdriver mentioned is easily modified or you can purchase something even more focused from Ferree's Tools as a D14 Sax Neck Screw Extractor.
• Definite focus should be paid to shoulder depth and height of the string plane. This can be measured and duplicated (reducing with a counterbore or increasing with agraffe washer) since agraffe production has changed over the years even on standard brands. 
• A supply of brass agraffe washers should always be carried to properly orient the stringholes to the scale line.
• Standard agraffe taps should always be used to chase the threads in the plate to avoid stripping or seizing the threads.
• If the hole is already mangled (most often from improper extraction techniques) or an odd-size agraffe thread, a group of Schaff (formerly from Pianotek) 927-ARI agraffe inserts live in my agraffe field kit along with the appropriate drills, taps, etc. 

I hope this helps!

AG

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

Thank you, everyone for your help with this. I returned today and extracted easily with reverse 1/8" drill bit and a little "guide" I bought. (Photos below.) The piano could use a lot more TLC, but it shaped up nicely (80 c pitch raise). 

The client is trying to downsize after his wife's passing three years ago. The piano was hers, he doesn't play and he plans to sell the piano. After tuning, I played my new favorite Sibelius piece. He broke down sobbing, and wasn't able to speak for a minute or two after I finished. Finally he got out the words, "I wish my wife could have heard that, she would have loved it." He asked me if I could play it again and record it for him (I included below, just a cell recording). 

For all the frustration of this piano, it was also very rewarding.

Recording: 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bCnP9WOCu2QRvIHxbmMjf7Zh9PeQeTXd/view?usp=drivesdk

(It's tuned to my Symmetrical Well Temperament)

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-12-2025 10:46
From: Jessica Masse
Subject: Broken agraffe

Original Message:
Sent: 9/11/2025 9:29:00 AM
From: Allan Gilreath
Subject: RE: Broken agraffe

Hi Tim,

You've gotten a lot of good responses. Here are a few items:

• If there's any portion of the stud sticking up at all, I've found the simplest, easiest, least intrusive approach is screw removing pliers. 
   

  
• If that isn't an option, I use a center punch to mark the center of the stud and use the lefthand spiral drill bit. I work very slowly and hope that the agraffe just backs out (which it usually does) and I'm ready to move forward. If it doesn't then I'm already drilling my hole for deeper work.
• If the threads are contaminated (sugary drink, urine, etc.) then I apply a few drops of penetrating oil and let it set for a bit before extracting. Galling is seldom a problem with agraffes due to the dissimilar metals (cast iron and brass)
• The screwdriver mentioned is easily modified or you can purchase something even more focused from Ferree's Tools as a D14 Sax Neck Screw Extractor.
• Definite focus should be paid to shoulder depth and height of the string plane. This can be measured and duplicated (reducing with a counterbore or increasing with agraffe washer) since agraffe production has changed over the years even on standard brands. 
• A supply of brass agraffe washers should always be carried to properly orient the stringholes to the scale line.
• Standard agraffe taps should always be used to chase the threads in the plate to avoid stripping or seizing the threads.
• If the hole is already mangled (most often from improper extraction techniques) or an odd-size agraffe thread, a group of Schaff (formerly from Pianotek) 927-ARI agraffe inserts live in my agraffe field kit along with the appropriate drills, taps, etc. 

I hope this helps!

AG

------------------------------
Allan Gilreath, RPT
Registered Piano Technician & President
Allan Gilreath & Associates, Inc
Calhoun, GA
706-602-7667
allan@allangilreath.com - www.allangilreath.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Hi Tim:

Was that the sintered bronze bearing you mentioned in another thread on the same topic?  Looks like it worked very well.  What was the link again?

EDIT:

Duh, I didn't realize it's the same thread.  But yeah, looks like it did the job.  Congrats!

------------------------------
Paul McCloud, RPT
Accutone Piano Service
www.AccutonePianoService.com
pavadasa@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-23-2025 13:22
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Thank you, everyone for your help with this. I returned today and extracted easily with reverse 1/8" drill bit and a little "guide" I bought. (Photos below.) The piano could use a lot more TLC, but it shaped up nicely (80 c pitch raise). 

The client is trying to downsize after his wife's passing three years ago. The piano was hers, he doesn't play and he plans to sell the piano. After tuning, I played my new favorite Sibelius piece. He broke down sobbing, and wasn't able to speak for a minute or two after I finished. Finally he got out the words, "I wish my wife could have heard that, she would have loved it." He asked me if I could play it again and record it for him (I included below, just a cell recording). 

For all the frustration of this piano, it was also very rewarding.

Recording: 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bCnP9WOCu2QRvIHxbmMjf7Zh9PeQeTXd/view?usp=drivesdk

(It's tuned to my Symmetrical Well Temperament)

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-12-2025 10:46
From: Jessica Masse
Subject: Broken agraffe

Original Message:
Sent: 9/11/2025 9:29:00 AM
From: Allan Gilreath
Subject: RE: Broken agraffe

Hi Tim,

You've gotten a lot of good responses. Here are a few items:

• If there's any portion of the stud sticking up at all, I've found the simplest, easiest, least intrusive approach is screw removing pliers. 
   

  
• If that isn't an option, I use a center punch to mark the center of the stud and use the lefthand spiral drill bit. I work very slowly and hope that the agraffe just backs out (which it usually does) and I'm ready to move forward. If it doesn't then I'm already drilling my hole for deeper work.
• If the threads are contaminated (sugary drink, urine, etc.) then I apply a few drops of penetrating oil and let it set for a bit before extracting. Galling is seldom a problem with agraffes due to the dissimilar metals (cast iron and brass)
• The screwdriver mentioned is easily modified or you can purchase something even more focused from Ferree's Tools as a D14 Sax Neck Screw Extractor.
• Definite focus should be paid to shoulder depth and height of the string plane. This can be measured and duplicated (reducing with a counterbore or increasing with agraffe washer) since agraffe production has changed over the years even on standard brands. 
• A supply of brass agraffe washers should always be carried to properly orient the stringholes to the scale line.
• Standard agraffe taps should always be used to chase the threads in the plate to avoid stripping or seizing the threads.
• If the hole is already mangled (most often from improper extraction techniques) or an odd-size agraffe thread, a group of Schaff (formerly from Pianotek) 927-ARI agraffe inserts live in my agraffe field kit along with the appropriate drills, taps, etc. 

I hope this helps!

AG

------------------------------
Allan Gilreath, RPT
Registered Piano Technician & President
Allan Gilreath & Associates, Inc
Calhoun, GA
706-602-7667
allan@allangilreath.com - www.allangilreath.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
------------------------------

Tim, what was the guide you used?

Hi Tim:

Was that the sintered bronze bearing you mentioned in another thread on the same topic?  Looks like it worked very well.  What was the link again?

EDIT:

Duh, I didn't realize it's the same thread.  But yeah, looks like it did the job.  Congrats!

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Paul McCloud, RPT
Accutone Piano Service
www.AccutonePianoService.com
pavadasa@gmail.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-23-2025 13:22
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

Thank you, everyone for your help with this. I returned today and extracted easily with reverse 1/8" drill bit and a little "guide" I bought. (Photos below.) The piano could use a lot more TLC, but it shaped up nicely (80 c pitch raise). 

The client is trying to downsize after his wife's passing three years ago. The piano was hers, he doesn't play and he plans to sell the piano. After tuning, I played my new favorite Sibelius piece. He broke down sobbing, and wasn't able to speak for a minute or two after I finished. Finally he got out the words, "I wish my wife could have heard that, she would have loved it." He asked me if I could play it again and record it for him (I included below, just a cell recording). 

For all the frustration of this piano, it was also very rewarding.

Recording: 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bCnP9WOCu2QRvIHxbmMjf7Zh9PeQeTXd/view?usp=drivesdk

(It's tuned to my Symmetrical Well Temperament)

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074

Original Message:
Sent: 09-12-2025 10:46
From: Jessica Masse
Subject: Broken agraffe

Original Message:
Sent: 9/11/2025 9:29:00 AM
From: Allan Gilreath
Subject: RE: Broken agraffe

Hi Tim,

You've gotten a lot of good responses. Here are a few items:

• If there's any portion of the stud sticking up at all, I've found the simplest, easiest, least intrusive approach is screw removing pliers. 
   

  
• If that isn't an option, I use a center punch to mark the center of the stud and use the lefthand spiral drill bit. I work very slowly and hope that the agraffe just backs out (which it usually does) and I'm ready to move forward. If it doesn't then I'm already drilling my hole for deeper work.
• If the threads are contaminated (sugary drink, urine, etc.) then I apply a few drops of penetrating oil and let it set for a bit before extracting. Galling is seldom a problem with agraffes due to the dissimilar metals (cast iron and brass)
• The screwdriver mentioned is easily modified or you can purchase something even more focused from Ferree's Tools as a D14 Sax Neck Screw Extractor.
• Definite focus should be paid to shoulder depth and height of the string plane. This can be measured and duplicated (reducing with a counterbore or increasing with agraffe washer) since agraffe production has changed over the years even on standard brands. 
• A supply of brass agraffe washers should always be carried to properly orient the stringholes to the scale line.
• Standard agraffe taps should always be used to chase the threads in the plate to avoid stripping or seizing the threads.
• If the hole is already mangled (most often from improper extraction techniques) or an odd-size agraffe thread, a group of Schaff (formerly from Pianotek) 927-ARI agraffe inserts live in my agraffe field kit along with the appropriate drills, taps, etc. 

I hope this helps!

AG

------------------------------
Allan Gilreath, RPT
Registered Piano Technician & President
Allan Gilreath & Associates, Inc
Calhoun, GA
706-602-7667
allan@allangilreath.com - www.allangilreath.com

Original Message:
Sent: 09-09-2025 12:25
From: Tim Foster
Subject: Broken agraffe

I've avoided it until now, but my "quick and easy" tuning job yesterday was anything but that. A426, broken bass string and a bi-cord sitting unnaturally high above the string level line. I spliced the bass string and did a pitch correction, but told the client I'd need to come back to finish (no problem on his end, he doesn't even play). Since I've not had to extract broken agraffes, it's difficult to weigh pros and cons with varying methods. I like the simplicity of Bruce Dornfeld's BAR (broken agraffe remover) in the 5/2023 issue (p. 8) where he suggests modifying a screwdriver with a sharp forked edge, pressing it into the agraffe stub in the plate and turning out. But if this fails, I would think I have a marred stub that may be more difficult to turn if this method fails. 

I would love any suggestions from those of you who have this chore "honed in." 

Thanks!

------------------------------
Tim Foster RPT
New Oxford PA
(470) 231-6074
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