Pianotech

  • 1.  current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-13-2023 12:47

    I'm looking for a torque wrench/gauge. Currently, one of the two big supply houses has one at $250.
    I think not...

    Park bike tools has one that measures inch/pounds at only about $40: 
    https://www.amazon.com/Park-Tool-TW-1-2-Beam-Type-Torque/dp/B09JB5N6K9/ref=asc_df_B09JB5N6K9/?tag=hyprod-20

    Would this work?

    Harbor Freight has a couple of digital models, and I remember someone recommending one in the Journal, but I can't find it now.
    By their specs, they only seem to to read in Ft-lbs, which would be too big of a scale.

    Also, I guess the big question is: Does a moderately experienced technician even need one? Can't someone who tunes a lot of pianos simply turn the pin and say either "too low" or "too high," and sense some intermediate values as well?

    Kind of like heart rate monitors for biking or running: Sure, you use it a lot for a while, then eventually it ends up in a drawer because it's not very difficult to sense how hard you're working.

    thanks!



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    Scott Cole, RPT
    rvpianotuner.com
    Talent, OR
    (541-601-9033
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  • 2.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-13-2023 18:29

    Hi Scott,
    It's a good exercise to measure the torque then turn it with your tuning lever. You're right, after a while you get a feel for the torque range and the tool may then sit on a shelf. I have an old Indestro brand torque wrench and use it every so often. It's good for assessing old pianos with low torque pins. Including numbers in your assessment helps people understand what loose means. Another useful situation is test drilling a new pinblock. Good to know where you're at.   

    If you end up deciding to purchase, grab something used off Ebay similar to this one. Overkill at 600 inch pounds but it's precise enough. Old tools are awesome. Here is another, better range but more expensive.




  • 3.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Member
    Posted 05-13-2023 21:36

    I have the beam torque wrench you mentioned but it cost 1/2 that price when I bought it new. It has proven itself over and over and gives hard evidence to support the need to treat a pinblock or diagnose why a piano is not tunable. Sampling pins throughout the scale and recording the information allows you to prove that a treatment with CA has worked. My records show that CA glue often doubles and triples the torque thanks to the torque wrench readings. $250 sounds like a lot but it will pay for itself 



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    James Kelly
    Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
    Pawleys Island SC
    (843) 325-4357
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    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-13-2023 22:28

    I don't have a torque wrench. Nor do I see the need for one in how I have set up my business. I have experienced pianos with what I would consider seriously insufficient torque consistently hold tunings just fine. (Mostly S&S.) I have experienced pianos with what feels like adequate torque, in that all the pins evenly feel sufficiently tight to hold a tuning, and yet some notes slip like crazy. And then I have experienced pins that are so tight that I was hardly able to move them at all.  Tuning was close to impossible. I have, therefore, taken the approach that if the tuning holds acceptably from one visit to the next then the torque is OK. If the tuning is noticeably slipping, especially if I bring it up and it immediately falls back down, then the torque is not OK. In other words, unless you're a rebuilder and actually need this information, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. 



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    Geoff Sykes, RPT
    Los Angeles CA
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  • 5.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-14-2023 23:36

    I got mine used off of eBay for around $40 and love it. For drilling a new pinblock, I was able to test. When a client has loose tuning pins, I can tell them exactly how much torque their pins currently have and what they should have. Numbers speak for themselves I think.



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    Tim Foster
    New Oxford PA
    (470) 231-6074
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  • 6.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Member
    Posted 05-15-2023 10:05

    Tim - you are exactly right about the numbers speaking for themselves. You can prove to a customer when you show them the torque indicator that the tuning pin is loose .Some other wise investments include moisture meters, temperature and humidity gauges, data loggers, inspection scopes, PTG Technical bulletins, Sanderson Acu-Fork 



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    James Kelly
    Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
    Pawleys Island SC
    (843) 325-4357
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    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-15-2023 19:29

    Hi Scott,

    I use a digital torque wrench that I picked up on Amazon for about $80. It can switch between in-lbs, ft-lbs, and Nm and the hold function is great for holding the max reading. 3/8" drive that easily fits the available tips. Range of 16-53- in lbs so it's good for reading tuning pin torque as well setting plate bolts/screws. I use it when pinning new blocks in addition to quantifying torque when evaluating for report. 


    I hope this helps. 


    AG



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    Allan Gilreath, RPT
    Registered Piano Technician & President
    Allan Gilreath & Associates, Inc
    Calhoun, GA
    706-602-7667
    allan@allangilreath.com - www.allangilreath.com
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  • 8.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-16-2023 07:45

    I have been asked by the manufacture on a couple of occasions to verify sales staff complaints about low torque on 
    new pianos on the sales floor. Having a device that could actually measure the resistance was absolutely necessary.
    Neither the manufacturer, sales staff nor the floor techs could dispute the findings as subjective. 

    I purchased a beam torque wrench in in/lbs at a pawn shop for under $15. 




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    Dave Conte, RPT

    Resident Technician
    The University of Tennessee
    Knoxville TN
    (817) 307-5656
    Owner: Rocky Top Piano
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    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Posted 05-16-2023 12:27

    New Britain TW 1-200 and Sturtevant Richmont DR200-1 beam torque wrenches pop up on eBay in pretty good condition for ~$20-30 now and then. If the beam is slightly off center, it can be recentered by gently bending it back.



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    Mathias Walters
    North Charleston SC
    (843) 619-7593
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  • 10.  RE: current torque wrench/gauge recommendations?

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 05-16-2023 12:56

    Lot of great replies everyone, thanks.

    I have a customer with a pretty new, famous-brand grand. Excellent instrument, but with alarmingly low torque.
    I can see that, should a warranty issue arise, the company will want numbers, not "it feels low to me."



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    Scott Cole, RPT
    rvpianotuner.com
    Talent, OR
    (541-601-9033
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    Original Message