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Workbench Clutter Syndrome

  • 1.  Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-29-2019 19:52
    Does anyone else suffer from the tendency to gradually clutter up the workbench with stuff that (although "important") is not immediately necessary for the work at hand, to the point where you are pushing stuff aside to make room to work on something...no matter how big the workbench is?

    A related problem is the tendency to use any and all horizontal surfaces as a "temporary" storage depot till it is completely covered and unusable for anything else.

    Am I the only one with this problem? Or is it one of those things we just don't talk about or admit? It's driving me nuts. I know, I know...a place for everything and everything in its place...no matter how hard I try to put things away it seems that my workspace seems to shrink somehow. Stuff just seems to accumulate!

    Does anyone else have this problem, and/or come up with a workable solution? (Other than extreme self discipline of course...)

    😩

    Pwg

    ------------------------------
    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    603-686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------


  • 2.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 08-29-2019 20:16
    Same problem, but no solution as of yet. I am pretty sure it happens because I am so dang single minded and I am always onto the next thing that I don't think to put stuff away. I'm working on it. :)

    ------------------------------
    John Formsma, RPT
    New Albany MS
    ------------------------------



  • 3.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 08-29-2019 20:59
    My shop has 70 feet of bench space...guess what...no space to work on said tables. It gets worse when I'm finishing cases...case parts all over the place and really nowhere to work on non-finishing. Thank goodness for my portable regulating table, which for some unknown reason, remains the only table surface which is immune to this particular disorder. .

    ------------------------------
    Jim Ialeggio
    grandpianosolutions.com
    Shirley, MA
    978 425-9026
    ------------------------------



  • 4.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-29-2019 21:11
    Solution: only one I've heard of. Make a "end of workday" ritual. Things you do in a specific order, every single day when you're wrapping things up. Of course you'll probably have to spend a day cleaning everything up initially first....

    Good luck... it's easier said than done, DAMNIK....

    ------------------------------
    Benjamin Sanchez, RPT
    Piano Technician / Artisan
    (805) 315-8050
    www.professional-piano-services.com
    ------------------------------



  • 5.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 08-29-2019 21:49
    It gets really bad...I mean clinical, man, when I'm inventing a new jig or process...really bad...high speed stream of consciousness operation with no brain space for anything even resembling tidiness.

    ------------------------------
    Jim Ialeggio
    grandpianosolutions.com
    Shirley, MA
    978 425-9026
    ------------------------------



  • 6.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-29-2019 21:59
    My solution is somewhat simple. My work bench is a folding table I set up in the carport. I do one project at a time, and when I'm done, I clean everything up so that can set the table against the wall and the car in carport. In my workshop is a bench which I use occasionally. But it's hot in the shop, so I seldom work in there. 

    I've always had a policy, even when I worked in larger shops in Missouri and Alabama, to always put away the tools and supplies when I got done with a project. The place would look like a disaster area while I'm working, but when I get done with a project, everything is put away. 

    It's a mind set I've had all my life. I don't know if you can change after all these years, Peter, but it's worth a try.

    ------------------------------
    Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
    Mililani, HI 96789
    ------------------------------



  • 7.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-29-2019 22:34
    Well, I'm feeling a little better knowing that I'm not the only one afflicted. However, as you say Wim, it has to be a mind set...i guess like exercise maybe. 

    Tools per se is not so much my problem (primarily). It's all the other junk (that I "know" I'm going to need/use at some point). I think if I put it away somewhere I won't be able to find it when I need it, so I leave it out where I can see it, but the use just doesn't come about...but I "know" it will at some point...and I can't make myself throw it away. 

    What is the psychology going on here?!?  Does anyone know?  Aaarrgh!

    Okay, so I need to discipline myself. I don't know how long it will last. They say you need to do something 30 days at least to make it a habit. Yikes!

    Pwg

    ------------------------------
    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    603-686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 8.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-29-2019 23:57
    You're certainly not alone.

    It gets worse as one gets older.

    The psychology involved, I think, is mental fatigue as the number of decisions gets out of hand, and as energy flags with increasing age.

    If there are heaps everywhere and any work space has to be fought for, the only way back out (not emergency shoving stuff around) is to pick up each individual thing, make a decision about it, and move it to where it should be. Triage: toss, donate, or organize and store.

    There are always other things one would rather do.

    The day end idea is good. Setting aside a certain time every day would help. Defining one small space to deal with in each session would help. Anything to keep from having to face the whole mess at once.

    If you've ever had to deal with the house of a deceased elderly relative, it is probably obvious to you that this is a battle which is often lost.

    In a way, progressively dealing with organization is a form of rejuvenation. Anything which helps general health and which improves one's state of mind could enable one to begin.

    ------------------------------
    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
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  • 9.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 02:30
    "it will at some point...and I can't make myself throw it away.  What is the psychology going on here?!?  Does anyone know?  Aaarrgh!"  Peter. 

    Part of this is the idea that we will use it again, sometime in the future, and that we don't want to buy it again. 

    Some of this is the hoarding instinct most of us have. We subconsciously want to keep things, but we know we only have so much space in our shop.

    There is nothing wrong with keeping supplies. We just have to know when enough is enough. If you can't do this on regular basis, schedule a shop clean up about once a moth. Throw away stuff you haven't used for a month. Put the rest away on bins. 
    .

    ------------------------------
    Willem "Wim" Blees, RPT
    Mililani, HI 96789
    ------------------------------



  • 10.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-29-2019 22:13
    On the other hand, sometimes you stop in the middle of a project and you actually want to leave the tools you are using where they are so you can just go in and pick up where you left off. 

    I was working at a studio in an earlier life, and the chief engineer was a stickler for keeping the shop neat and tidy. More than once I would get up to do something like grab a sandwich and come back only to find my entire work space empty. He was upset with me because I left the area NOT tidy. I was upset with him because now I had to go find everything, again, and go back a couple of steps in order to pick up where I left off. 

    That said, I only work on one project at a time. And at the end of any given project, I, like Wim, have to clean up everything so I can fold up my shop table and put it away.

    ------------------------------
    Geoff Sykes, RPT
    Los Angeles CA
    ------------------------------



  • 11.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 08-30-2019 06:59
      |   view attached
    Not me...always neat as a pin...

    ------------------------------
    Regards,

    Jon Page
    mailto:jonpage@pianocapecod.com
    http://www.pianocapecod.com
    ------------------------------



  • 12.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Member
    Posted 08-30-2019 08:00
    When I was a professional chef, the saying was that "a good cook is a messy cook." 

    I apply the same standard to my piano work.


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    Don Dalton
    Chester VT
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  • 13.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 08-30-2019 08:14
    I'm pretty sure humans share a gene or two with the Pack Rat.

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    Barb Bernhardt
    Montrose, Colorado
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  • 14.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 10:02
    I'm the same way. To an outsider, both my school and home shop can look like a tool bomb went off. Oddly enough, I'm usually acutely aware of where everything is. Thriving in chaos, I suppose. I do take the time to clean and organize between projects so I can create fresh chaos on a regular basis.

    --
    Mick Johnson, R.P.T.
    University of Nebraska, Kearney
    Kearney, NE
    308-237-9264





  • 15.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 08-30-2019 10:08
    This thread is a particular comfort!

    The other week I did some experiments with microphones for recordings and put them in order placed by results. Then wife tidied them . . . . 

    Best wishes

    David P

    --
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    David Pinnegar, B.Sc., A.R.C.S.
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    +44 1342 850594





  • 16.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 10:19
    David,

    Yes...that is also an issue. 😁



    But I will say that actually talking about it here is mildly therapeutic. I'm already starting to apply the different suggestions. I actually threw some stuff out this morning and am beginning to re-assess my viewpoint of what is necessary and what is not.  It ain't easy though. 

    Pwg

    ------------------------------
    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    603-686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 17.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 08-30-2019 10:35
    It was a  2019  well '18 '17 and a few others! New Years Resolution but hey its still only September plenty of time left!!...martin.
    www.snowpianos.com

    ------------------------------
    Martin Snow
    South Burlington VT
    617-543-1030
    ------------------------------



  • 18.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 10:40
    If a really good New Year's Resolution was put in a deep freeze on January 2nd, why shouldn't it still be just as good?

    ------------------------------
    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
    ------------------------------



  • 19.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 10:35
    David, that's one problem I don't have. If anything is where it shouldn't be, it's because I put it there.

    ------------------------------
    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
    ------------------------------



  • 20.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 10:59

    Mick,  You must have been to my house as well.  Car tools at home (son's an avid mechanic) and lots of everything all over my shop, not just the bench!






  • 21.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 11:14
    Any good tips out there on workbench organization? Take a couple of photos and send them in to me for TTT!

    ------------------------------
    Scott Cole, RPT
    rvpianotuner.com
    Talent, OR
    (541-601-9033
    ------------------------------



  • 22.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 12:32
    Hi all,

    This is an interesting podcast I listened to a few weeks ago. I'm pretty sure this covers workspace clutter as one of the side points, but someone let me know if it doesn't and I'll try to find the right one.

    https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/building-a-storybrand-with-donald-miller/id1092751338?i=1000445023619

    ------------------------------
    Benjamin Sanchez, RPT
    Piano Technician / Artisan
    (805) 315-8050
    www.professional-piano-services.com
    ------------------------------



  • 23.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 08-30-2019 15:30
    I think we're coming at this backwards. A certain amount of clutter is a healthy sign. I mean, as a community whose very DNA is defined by OCD and compulsive tendencies...compulsiveness, being a necessary component of our job...the tendency to let go of the day's compulsivity, by accepting some extent of personal clutter, is freeing and therapeutic. 

    I have been in and worked, however briefly, in an off the deep end neat-nick's compulsive space. The entire tenor of the engagement, and general unpleasantness of working with someone that that picky was demoralizing...gave me the creeps...and this is coming from a picky (by definition) guy.   

    We let the shop clutter level rise, usually until some either significant, or not-so-significant milestone in the project is reached, then look around and say, "Its getting bad, man the vacuum cleaners". Actually along these lines, when I first was working in this field, I was way too compulsive, in a not healthy way. The acceptance of the ebb and flow of clutter, is a symptom, in a larger sense, that I have let go of other unrealistic expectations about the work and the piano in general, and I like myself and the work much better, for the long haul.

    The ebb and flow of clutter is a flow that reflects the nature of reality. The flow is our friend.

    ------------------------------
    Jim Ialeggio
    grandpianosolutions.com
    Shirley, MA
    978 425-9026
    ------------------------------



  • 24.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 08-30-2019 16:22
    I'm moderately bad. Hubby is a little worse than me but not by much. We go thorough organizational sprees a couple times a year. Our biggest problem has been time. We try to do too much & have too many projects going on at one time. We're not willing to give up TOO much sleep, so... Que sera, sera.  Some major changes in our schedules are coming, so there will be hope after Christmas. We'll see if we can actually change old habits. ;-)

    ------------------------------
    Maggie Jusiel
    Athens, WV
    (304)952-8615
    mags@timandmaggie.net
    ------------------------------



  • 25.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Member
    Posted 09-01-2019 09:52
    Excellent ... rest assured you are not the only one with things all over the place . One way to solve the issue is to get into the habit of reserving time at the end of the shop session to sweep up, hang up, store things away. Easy to say tougher to do . I think our brains are wired differently because we think outside the box and are focused on doing work that keeps us too busy to worry about a neat bench. I am slowly beginning to realize that it is worth the time to at least sort things into some organized fashion. Clear shoe boxes are a great start even though I like the idea of fancy tool boxes like the ones at the front of the store in Home Depot or in the catalogs. I can't say I have two of everything but I probably do. Maybe we need some classes at convention on shop organization but it is probably useless for most of us who are disorganized organized . So run to home depot and buy the four packs of clear shoe boxes with lids for $3.98 and at least sort out your screwdrivers, wrenches, ratchets, glues, polishes, felts . Guaranteed you will find things you didn't even know you had. I just found the fluegelbauer key bushing tool that I have been looking for but still am looking for the spare charger for my SATIII

    ------------------------------
    James Kelly
    Pawleys Island SC
    843-325-4357
    ------------------------------



  • 26.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 09-01-2019 09:49
    My name is Les Koltvedt and I have a HORIZONTAL SURFACE problem

    ------------------------------
    Leslie Koltvedt
    Marietta GA
    734-657-7034
    ------------------------------



  • 27.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-01-2019 12:24

    Hi Leslie!

     

    Paul

     






  • 28.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 09-01-2019 12:29
    Im assuming the meeting room will be full,  glad i came early

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    Leslie Koltvedt
    Marietta GA
    734-657-7034
    ------------------------------



  • 29.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-01-2019 14:55
    I have designated clutter spaces.  That way I have space I don't need to clear so I can work efficiently and space that lets me pile up "stuff".  The clutter spaces get cleared when it seems time.

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    Tim Coates
    Sioux Falls SD
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  • 30.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-01-2019 18:33
    Since starting this thread I have now made (what I consider to be) significant progress. My main workbench now has at least twice as much room on it as it did before. I have bitten the bullet and started throwing out stuff that's just been hanging around...moved here and there, etc. I have asked myself when was the last time I used this...ehat is the likelihood of using it anytime soon...if the answer warrants it, into the trash it goes. 

    Had a significant bonfire last night...nothing important m, just stuff laying around inside, outside, leftovers...😩. It actually is starting to feel good to make these decisions and then follow through.  The nice thing about fire us that you CAN'T change your mind.  

    Still have a ways to go. 

    Les,

    My wife tells me that I will fill any horizontal surface with stuff.  It is technically true. I am now determined to break that habit. 

    This is like talking to a therapist. Cool!

    Pwg

    ------------------------------
    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    603-686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 31.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-01-2019 21:28
    It's true that vertical surfaces are more likely to be free of clutter, but things can still be leaned against them.

    ------------------------------
    Susan Kline
    Philomath, Oregon
    ------------------------------



  • 32.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-01-2019 22:25
    I had the opportunity to visit Ron Nossman’s shop years ago in Wichita. He was truly the master of vertical storage. I have never seen a space so full, yet so functional.

    Sent from my iPhone




  • 33.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-02-2019 10:22
    Mick,

    Any ideas to suggest?

    Pwg

    ------------------------------
    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    603-686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------



  • 34.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-02-2019 17:35
    Peter, the main points I took away from Ron were:
    1. Use walls and overhead space for storage. Walls provide tons of
    space for shallow shelves , racks, bins etc. I have 24” deep shelves
    and cabinets around most of the perimeter of my shop- high enough for
    me to walk under. If it’s over my head, it’s not in the way.
    I built two drawers under my workbench to hold frequently used tools.
    They are still high enough to allow room for my rolling action table
    to fit underneath with an action on top. I’ll even store things on the
    bottom shelf of the table from time to time.
    (Messy photo attached)
    2. Temporary work surfaces.
    Ron had a large sturdy table saw in the middle of the floor which he
    would cover with a tabletop to make it double as a bench. In addition
    to the rolling table, I have a table that folds out from the wall made
    from an old upright bottom panel. I also use an old maple key bed from
    that same old upright on a portable keyboard stand as a temporary
    bench. I haul that to job sites from time to time.
    3. If it's going to take up space, make sure it is multi-purpose (if
    possible). Ron even used his soundboard hot box for storage.

    Sent from my iPhone




  • 35.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Posted 09-02-2019 13:18
    Yeah, it was pretty amazing how he could work in that area. Great guy, and he is missed!

    ------------------------------
    John Formsma, RPT
    New Albany MS
    ------------------------------



  • 36.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-03-2019 01:21
    Mick, I made a portable stand using a keyboard stand as well. I drilled holes in the crossbars and put carriage bolts through the table so it is at keybed height and absolutely secure. I used 5/8ths ply and the whole thing collapses down to about 3 inches. Very portable, light, and an easy extra table in the shop. My table is minimal dimensions, 17"deep x 48" so keyboards hang over the sides. But it's still good for out of keybed reg. and voicing and it gets the keyboard out of the way for work inside the keybed. Really handy. Easy to put in the car or store in a closet.


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    Steven Rosenthal
    Honolulu HI
    808-521-7129
    ------------------------------



  • 37.  RE: Workbench Clutter Syndrome

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 09-22-2019 19:38
    I have realized that I have a SERIOUS problem with putting things away after use. It is very hard to break this tendency. 😲

    'Inch by inch..."

    Pwg

    ------------------------------
    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    603-686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
    ------------------------------