Pianotech

I've just got done combing through a number of discussion posts about CA glue as a fix for loose tuning pins- as well as a journal search- though I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to my question. 

The closest I got was a 2003 Journal Article written  by Dan Levitan 'CA Glue Angst' which essentially posed the same question 

" Is using CA glue as a temporary fix for loose tuning pins a problem for the pinblock upon later rebuilds/restringing?"


I have a 1917 Mason and Hamlin Model A. Pinblock looks to me to be in decent condition- (it's not delaminating or cracked)- though I admittedly don't have much experience here. The pins are rather loose- even after pounding them in with a pin setter tool. 

I am planning on restoring this piano, eventually restringing it and putting in #3 pins when I do- but it would be nice to tighten the pins up in the meantime if I'm not going to be damaging the pinblock and harming the eventual restringing. 

I've just got done combing through a number of discussion posts about CA glue as a fix for loose tuning pins- as well as a journal search- though I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to my question. 

The closest I got was a 2003 Journal Article written  by Dan Levitan 'CA Glue Angst' which essentially posed the same question 

" Is using CA glue as a temporary fix for loose tuning pins a problem for the pinblock upon later rebuilds/restringing?"


I have a 1917 Mason and Hamlin Model A. Pinblock looks to me to be in decent condition- (it's not delaminating or cracked)- though I admittedly don't have much experience here. The pins are rather loose- even after pounding them in with a pin setter tool. 

I am planning on restoring this piano, eventually restringing it and putting in #3 pins when I do- but it would be nice to tighten the pins up in the meantime if I'm not going to be damaging the pinblock and harming the eventual restringing. 

I've just got done combing through a number of discussion posts about CA glue as a fix for loose tuning pins- as well as a journal search- though I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to my question. 

The closest I got was a 2003 Journal Article written  by Dan Levitan 'CA Glue Angst' which essentially posed the same question 

" Is using CA glue as a temporary fix for loose tuning pins a problem for the pinblock upon later rebuilds/restringing?"


I have a 1917 Mason and Hamlin Model A. Pinblock looks to me to be in decent condition- (it's not delaminating or cracked)- though I admittedly don't have much experience here. The pins are rather loose- even after pounding them in with a pin setter tool. 

I am planning on restoring this piano, eventually restringing it and putting in #3 pins when I do- but it would be nice to tighten the pins up in the meantime if I'm not going to be damaging the pinblock and harming the eventual restringing. 

I've just got done combing through a number of discussion posts about CA glue as a fix for loose tuning pins- as well as a journal search- though I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to my question. 

The closest I got was a 2003 Journal Article written  by Dan Levitan 'CA Glue Angst' which essentially posed the same question 

" Is using CA glue as a temporary fix for loose tuning pins a problem for the pinblock upon later rebuilds/restringing?"


I have a 1917 Mason and Hamlin Model A. Pinblock looks to me to be in decent condition- (it's not delaminating or cracked)- though I admittedly don't have much experience here. The pins are rather loose- even after pounding them in with a pin setter tool. 

I am planning on restoring this piano, eventually restringing it and putting in #3 pins when I do- but it would be nice to tighten the pins up in the meantime if I'm not going to be damaging the pinblock and harming the eventual restringing. 

I've just got done combing through a number of discussion posts about CA glue as a fix for loose tuning pins- as well as a journal search- though I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to my question. 

The closest I got was a 2003 Journal Article written  by Dan Levitan 'CA Glue Angst' which essentially posed the same question 

" Is using CA glue as a temporary fix for loose tuning pins a problem for the pinblock upon later rebuilds/restringing?"


I have a 1917 Mason and Hamlin Model A. Pinblock looks to me to be in decent condition- (it's not delaminating or cracked)- though I admittedly don't have much experience here. The pins are rather loose- even after pounding them in with a pin setter tool. 

I am planning on restoring this piano, eventually restringing it and putting in #3 pins when I do- but it would be nice to tighten the pins up in the meantime if I'm not going to be damaging the pinblock and harming the eventual restringing. 

From a business standpoint, I would decline to re-pin with larger size tuning pins a pinblock that had been treated with any type of pinblock treatment. Re-stringing a piano with an existing treated pinblock introduces another uncontrolled variable into the job. The rebuilder (i.e. you) will be expected to warranty their re-stringing work with either an old or new pinblock. It may be technically feasible to re-string a treated pinblock (I would argue that it is not), but from a business perspective I would plan on replacing the pinblock in the future if treated now.  

I've just got done combing through a number of discussion posts about CA glue as a fix for loose tuning pins- as well as a journal search- though I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to my question. 

The closest I got was a 2003 Journal Article written  by Dan Levitan 'CA Glue Angst' which essentially posed the same question 

" Is using CA glue as a temporary fix for loose tuning pins a problem for the pinblock upon later rebuilds/restringing?"


I have a 1917 Mason and Hamlin Model A. Pinblock looks to me to be in decent condition- (it's not delaminating or cracked)- though I admittedly don't have much experience here. The pins are rather loose- even after pounding them in with a pin setter tool. 

I am planning on restoring this piano, eventually restringing it and putting in #3 pins when I do- but it would be nice to tighten the pins up in the meantime if I'm not going to be damaging the pinblock and harming the eventual restringing. 

Thanks all for the advice.

I'm planning on doing the CA glue treatment, both as a temporary fix and as an opportunity to practice doing so- it will be a good learning process to see how that affects the pins - with the intention of replacing the pinblock when I finally get around to shimming the soundboard and replacing the strings.

A few follow up questions. 

1. How does one evaluate a pinblock? When I look at the block underneath with a light, It's clear that there are no cracks in it- however, is it possible for a pinblock to be cracked only in the interior? What would the symptoms to look for be? (Any titles of journal articles I should look for?)

2. - James Kelley mentions using a torque wrench to measure inch pounds of torque- How exactly would I go about doing this? I do have a torque wrench- though I imagine you'd need a specialty tuning pin head for it? 

3. John Ginter- As a rebuilder, how would you tell if a pinblock had been treated by a pinblock treatment, say if your customer didn't know that it had been? What is your arguement regarding the non feasability of re-stringing/pinning a treated pinblock? I'm now planning on replacing the current one eventually, but I'm curious to know your reasoning. 

From a business standpoint, I would decline to re-pin with larger size tuning pins a pinblock that had been treated with any type of pinblock treatment. Re-stringing a piano with an existing treated pinblock introduces another uncontrolled variable into the job. The rebuilder (i.e. you) will be expected to warranty their re-stringing work with either an old or new pinblock. It may be technically feasible to re-string a treated pinblock (I would argue that it is not), but from a business perspective I would plan on replacing the pinblock in the future if treated now.  

I've just got done combing through a number of discussion posts about CA glue as a fix for loose tuning pins- as well as a journal search- though I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to my question. 

The closest I got was a 2003 Journal Article written  by Dan Levitan 'CA Glue Angst' which essentially posed the same question 

" Is using CA glue as a temporary fix for loose tuning pins a problem for the pinblock upon later rebuilds/restringing?"


I have a 1917 Mason and Hamlin Model A. Pinblock looks to me to be in decent condition- (it's not delaminating or cracked)- though I admittedly don't have much experience here. The pins are rather loose- even after pounding them in with a pin setter tool. 

I am planning on restoring this piano, eventually restringing it and putting in #3 pins when I do- but it would be nice to tighten the pins up in the meantime if I'm not going to be damaging the pinblock and harming the eventual restringing. 

Thanks all for the advice.

I'm planning on doing the CA glue treatment, both as a temporary fix and as an opportunity to practice doing so- it will be a good learning process to see how that affects the pins - with the intention of replacing the pinblock when I finally get around to shimming the soundboard and replacing the strings.

A few follow up questions. 

1. How does one evaluate a pinblock? When I look at the block underneath with a light, It's clear that there are no cracks in it- however, is it possible for a pinblock to be cracked only in the interior? What would the symptoms to look for be? (Any titles of journal articles I should look for?)

2. - James Kelley mentions using a torque wrench to measure inch pounds of torque- How exactly would I go about doing this? I do have a torque wrench- though I imagine you'd need a specialty tuning pin head for it? 

3. John Ginter- As a rebuilder, how would you tell if a pinblock had been treated by a pinblock treatment, say if your customer didn't know that it had been? What is your arguement regarding the non feasability of re-stringing/pinning a treated pinblock? I'm now planning on replacing the current one eventually, but I'm curious to know your reasoning. 

From a business standpoint, I would decline to re-pin with larger size tuning pins a pinblock that had been treated with any type of pinblock treatment. Re-stringing a piano with an existing treated pinblock introduces another uncontrolled variable into the job. The rebuilder (i.e. you) will be expected to warranty their re-stringing work with either an old or new pinblock. It may be technically feasible to re-string a treated pinblock (I would argue that it is not), but from a business perspective I would plan on replacing the pinblock in the future if treated now.  

I've just got done combing through a number of discussion posts about CA glue as a fix for loose tuning pins- as well as a journal search- though I haven't been able to find a definitive answer to my question. 

The closest I got was a 2003 Journal Article written  by Dan Levitan 'CA Glue Angst' which essentially posed the same question 

" Is using CA glue as a temporary fix for loose tuning pins a problem for the pinblock upon later rebuilds/restringing?"


I have a 1917 Mason and Hamlin Model A. Pinblock looks to me to be in decent condition- (it's not delaminating or cracked)- though I admittedly don't have much experience here. The pins are rather loose- even after pounding them in with a pin setter tool. 

I am planning on restoring this piano, eventually restringing it and putting in #3 pins when I do- but it would be nice to tighten the pins up in the meantime if I'm not going to be damaging the pinblock and harming the eventual restringing.