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problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

  • 1.  problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Member
    Posted 20 days ago

    My Customer has a 5' Howard grand I tuned for the last three years and before she moved on April 20, 2026 I checked it and tuning was OK( Normal)

    So I told her we would tune it after she moved it (approx. 20 miles, simple move).

    Here is the problem: After it sat in the new place for two weeks I came in to tune it and the A440 was at 417 and all the the other keys dropped the same amounts

    across all the keys (all very consistent).

    I called Nate at Cyber tuner thinking something was wrong- All was okey there.

    Other Notes:

    Both houses were air conditioned

    Both houses had Dampp chasers plugged in.

    Time from one house to other house, 30 min.

    all solid smooth roads (no gravel/bumpy) 

    Customer stated, move went very good on both ends.(did not drop piano, etc.)

    Any suggestions,

    Thanks and Bless

    Proteck Chuck

    Florida 



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    Chuck Dempsey
    Sebring FL
    (863) 446-0272
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  • 2.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 20 days ago
    A lot has to do with where in the house the piano is located compared to where it was before. Rooms that have a lot of humidity can greatly affect the wood in the piano, like the kitchen, the bathroom, the laundry room. Or an outside door or window that is open more than usual.

    Did you check the pitch several different times, over several days?

    Other than that, I have no clue.

    Wim
    Sent from my iPhone




  • 3.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 20 days ago

    Chuck,

    In all my decades as a piano technician, this is the first time I have heard of a piano changing pitch that much is such a short amount of time. Even more amazing (to me, at least) is that it changed pitch uniformly, like what a wammy bar does to a chord played on an electric guitar.

    Hmm…



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    Alan Eder, RPT
    Herb Alpert School of Music
    California Institute of the Arts
    Valencia, CA
    661.904.6483
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  • 4.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 20 days ago

    Hi Chuck,

    I'm also puzzled. It's almost like it baked in one of those PODS storage units for several weeks. Is it possible that the bridges, soundboard, or ribs may have come loose?

    Were you able to tune it? If so, how did it respond? 



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    Benjamin Sanchez, RPT
    (256) 947-9999
    www.professional-piano-services.com
    www.FromZeroToSixFiguresBook.com
    www.PianoCraftTechnicalSchool.com
    ------------------------------



  • 5.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 19 days ago
    I don’t understand what insight Cybertuner would offer about the pitch change??

    I would thoroughly inspect the plate, the rim, the ribs and the braces, pinblock and bridges. I have seen several occasions where the piano movers did not disclose anything and yet clearly the piano was damaged during the move.

    Joe Wiencek
    NYC


    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Member
    Posted 19 days ago

    When a piano drops pitch as far as this one in this short of a time, I always look for major structural issues. Is there a problem with the pinblock separating from the back? Was the piano dropped in the move? Even a small drop can cause a weak spot to suddenly become a major problem.



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    Rex Roseman
    Roseman Piano Tuning
    Copley, OH
    330-289-2948
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  • 7.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Member
    Posted 19 days ago

    After I sent the last message, I realized it was a grand. But the place to look would be the wedge between the pinblock and the horn.



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    Rex Roseman
    Roseman Piano Tuning
    Copley, OH
    330-289-2948
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    Original Message


  • 8.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 19 days ago

    While I haven't experienced any pitch drops that major, I have seen fairly significant pitch changes when the piano was placed over a vent. In agreement with Rex, I would also check for structural damage, even checking the plate. Please keep us posted if you find the culprit, this is a very interesting case.



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    Tim Foster RPT
    New Oxford PA
    (470) 231-6074
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    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 19 days ago

    When you said both locations had A/C, that signaled a red flag for me.  I once had a console in a room that the A/C made very cold.  It hadn't been tuned for quite a while, so I was raising the pitch.  I was there for almost 3 hours (!), and I had to leave because I had another appointment.  I could not stabilize the piano.  I set another appointment and returned a couple weeks later.  This time the A/C was off, and the room temp was normal, around 70.  The piano tuned up just fine.  In San Diego we don't have excessive humidity or dryness except on rare occasions.  In Florida, humidity is typically very high, and running an A/C can pull some of that humidity out of the air.  Your piano has dropped almost a half step, evenly, so barring any structural failure, my guess is related to the room temperature and the A/C.  The real question is, did the piano stabilize when you tuned it?  Or did you attempt to tune it at all?  Was the room cold when you tuned it at the old location?  What was the temperature when you came to the new location?  Was the A/C on or off?  And of course any vents, fireplace or source of heat, or sun exposure that could also contribute to the environment.  I always ask the piano owner to shut all doors and windows before I tune the piano, and A/C also, because it affects the tuning.



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    Paul McCloud, RPT
    Accutone Piano Service
    www.AccutonePianoService.com
    pavadasa@gmail.com
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  • 10.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Member
    Posted 19 days ago

    Was this a self move or an inexperienced move because of the short distance ? What kind of torque is in the tuning pins ? I would suspect some environmental factor and get some readings . The humidity in the new location could have been a shock to the system despite having the ac on and a dampp chaser. Maybe the new location had the ac off while the move in was going on and 2 weeks was too soon to tune it. Even though you are in Florida maybe you had to have the heat on during some of the crazy weather. I take care of an 1877 C Bechstein in a choir room at a local church . The room is also used for Bible Studies, meetings, crafts . The tuning was all over the place and I found r/h was down to 25 % . Installed a full DC and in a week tuning stabilized and the crack in the soundboard closed.

    Several other possibles : the pinblock is cracked, the plate is cracked, the bridges are shifting due to poor glue bond to the soundboard. How old is the piano ?



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    James Kelly
    Owner- Fur Elise Piano Service
    Pawleys Island SC
    (843) 325-4357
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  • 11.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 19 days ago

    Chuck,

    You mentioned that all the notes dropped equally. Because we as piano technicians know that the top 2 or 3 notes don't move much (certainly not as much as the mid sections) due to humidity changes I would peg the conundrum to the possibility that you inadvertently tuned the piano low at the last tuning.

    Roger



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    Roger Gable RPT
    Gable Piano
    Everett WA
    (425) 252-5000
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  • 12.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Posted 19 days ago
    Hi Chuck, Direct sunlight could cause this.





  • 13.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Registered Piano Technician
    Posted 19 days ago

    Also...not all A/C systems are created equal. An over-powered (or old) system in the first house that cools but leaves a higher RH vs a slightly underpowered (and/or new) system in the new house that brings the RH down much more, could be responsible. 

    Peter Grey Piano Doctor 



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    Peter Grey
    Stratham NH
    (603) 686-2395
    pianodoctor57@gmail.com
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    Original Message


  • 14.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Posted 19 days ago

    417Hz is close to 100 cents below 440Hz.

    Is there any chance the piano was accidentally (or intentionally) tuned a half-step flat before it was moved?

    Otherwise Fenton's hypothesis that the strings were warmed is the best.

    Also, it might help if you told us what vintage Howard this is. US, Japan or Korea(?)?



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    Ed Sutton
    ed440@me.com
    (980) 254-7413
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  • 15.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Posted 18 days ago

    I always check the plate bolt or screws after a move. If they were slightly loose before the move, you can bet the plate shifted ever so slightly.

    Up here in the dry country air of the mountains, I've cured many noises and strange tuning shifts by checking the plate bolts



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    Keith Roberts
    owner
    Hathaway Pines CA
    (209) 770-4312
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    Original Message


  • 16.  RE: problem with grand piano drop in pitch after move across all keys

    Posted 17 days ago

    How were the unisons? If they were anything other than wildly out of tune, I'd say there's an oversight happening, and it was just tuned low. It having dropped uniformly makes this sound more likely.

    I've been dealing with pianos going through huge humidity shifts - under 20% up past 60%, and having tuned them at both extremes. I don't think a shift from 440 to 417 due to humidity is possible. But structural damage couldn't possibly result in an even drop.



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    Robin Whitehouse
    Greenbelt, MD
    D.C. Chapter 201
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